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I have a colleague from Russia who moved here a few years ago. But.. still he is using talking-points that come from Kremlin's propaganda, like "The US will fig

I have a colleague from Russia who moved here a few years ago. But.. still he is using talking-points that come from Kremlin's propaganda, like "The US will fight Russia to the last ukrainian" and "I would feel safer here if we weren't in NATO, this makes us a target for Russia" and "You know that it was promised that NATO wouldn't expand?" and "Your country joined the Soviet Union voluntarily". So.. even when some people move abroad and say they don't support Putin, they still have this.. imperialist mindset that everyone is out to get Russia and it's actions are justified to protect itself and so on. As an explanation about what people think, not as an accusation against you.

therusskiy 5y ago
he came to Georgia under difference circumstances though, not running away from the government like the people fleeing right now
CapricornNoble 5y ago
>>>still he is using talking-points that come from Kremlin's propaganda, like "The US will fight Russia to the last ukrainian" That's considered "Russian propaganda"? We've managed to goad Putin into grinding up his conventional military in a large-scale war. We've set the Russian economy back decades. And we've so far pulled off both of these, without any NATO member paying a massive price in blood for it. Russian propaganda? More like "Greatest US foreign policy success of the 21st century". I've been really critical of the moves we've made in Europe for the past 10-15 years, but I have to say, if this doesn't escalate into WW3....kudos to the CIA and the State Department for playing the long game and having it work out. But it definitely sucks for the Ukrainians. I still would have preferred the relationship we had with Russia in the early 2000s. It would have been nice to leverage Russia's geographic position in the inevitable confrontation with China: a bunch of Russian tank divisions under a nuclear umbrella in Siberia would keep China nervous about a vulnerable 2nd front, and perhaps unable to mass combat power against Taiwan/Japan/etc.
- skeletal88 5y ago
  He explained that the crisis in Russia is the fault of / was somehow started by the US. He said that a few months ago, not this week. Now he doesn't say anything anymore.
- jquery 5y ago
  Don’t let Putin off the hook for his own bad decision to invade. The USA did nothing but tell the world what Putin was planning, we did not goad him into it. Nobody put a gun to Putin’s head and said invade or else.
  - CapricornNoble 5y ago
    I look at it like this: The US has spent ~15 years holding it's finger 5mm in front of Russia's eye saying "I'm not touching you...I'm not touching you....I'm not touching you." When that hasn't been working, we then whispered "Oh by the way, I'm the reason your ex-wife Ukraine left you. I'm definitely touching her." When Russia finally snaps, slaps our hand out of its face, and uppercuts Ukraine**, we sit there with a smug look on our facing going "Dude, why are you such an asshole?"
- koonsolo 5y ago
  > I've been really critical of the moves we've made in Europe for the past 10-15 years So Germany buying gas from Russia, then trying to buy even more gas and then for a large part depending on it. Do you consider that a good or a bad move?
  - CapricornNoble 5y ago
    2000-2010? Good move. Would have helped with integration of Russia into Europe. Post 2010 (really post 2007-2008, but it might have taken a few years to react): bad move. This is roughly when the relationship between the US-led NATO and Russia really soured. It should have been obvious what kind of long game the US was playing, given the switch from a Republican President (Bush) to a Democrat one (Obama). Yet the hardline against Russia remained, clearly the work of the entrenched bureaucrats (aka the "Deep State") beholden to neither party's politics for their power. At that point Germany should have hedged its bets by finding alternative industrial power (keep your nuclear plants!) and heating (other natgas exporters).

therusskiy 5y ago

he came to Georgia under difference circumstances though, not running away from the government like the people fleeing right now

CapricornNoble 5y ago

>>>still he is using talking-points that come from Kremlin's propaganda, like "The US will fight Russia to the last ukrainian" That's considered "Russian propaganda"? We've managed to goad Putin into grinding up his conventional military in a large-scale war. We've set the Russian economy back decades. And we've so far pulled off both of these, without any NATO member paying a massive price in blood for it. Russian propaganda? More like "Greatest US foreign policy success of the 21st century". I've been really critical of the moves we've made in Europe for the past 10-15 years, but I have to say, if this doesn't escalate into WW3....kudos to the CIA and the State Department for playing the long game and having it work out. But it definitely sucks for the Ukrainians. I still would have preferred the relationship we had with Russia in the early 2000s. It would have been nice to leverage Russia's geographic position in the inevitable confrontation with China: a bunch of Russian tank divisions under a nuclear umbrella in Siberia would keep China nervous about a vulnerable 2nd front, and perhaps unable to mass combat power against Taiwan/Japan/etc.

skeletal88 5y ago
He explained that the crisis in Russia is the fault of / was somehow started by the US. He said that a few months ago, not this week. Now he doesn't say anything anymore.
jquery 5y ago
Don’t let Putin off the hook for his own bad decision to invade. The USA did nothing but tell the world what Putin was planning, we did not goad him into it. Nobody put a gun to Putin’s head and said invade or else.
- CapricornNoble 5y ago
  I look at it like this: The US has spent ~15 years holding it's finger 5mm in front of Russia's eye saying "I'm not touching you...I'm not touching you....I'm not touching you." When that hasn't been working, we then whispered "Oh by the way, I'm the reason your ex-wife Ukraine left you. I'm definitely touching her." When Russia finally snaps, slaps our hand out of its face, and uppercuts Ukraine**, we sit there with a smug look on our facing going "Dude, why are you such an asshole?"
koonsolo 5y ago
> I've been really critical of the moves we've made in Europe for the past 10-15 years So Germany buying gas from Russia, then trying to buy even more gas and then for a large part depending on it. Do you consider that a good or a bad move?
- CapricornNoble 5y ago
  2000-2010? Good move. Would have helped with integration of Russia into Europe. Post 2010 (really post 2007-2008, but it might have taken a few years to react): bad move. This is roughly when the relationship between the US-led NATO and Russia really soured. It should have been obvious what kind of long game the US was playing, given the switch from a Republican President (Bush) to a Democrat one (Obama). Yet the hardline against Russia remained, clearly the work of the entrenched bureaucrats (aka the "Deep State") beholden to neither party's politics for their power. At that point Germany should have hedged its bets by finding alternative industrial power (keep your nuclear plants!) and heating (other natgas exporters).