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Marijuana is still illegal in some states as well. This is the beauty of states rights vs federal laws. The states change, based on the merit of the idea, not

Marijuana is still illegal in some states as well. This is the beauty of states rights vs federal laws. The states change, based on the merit of the idea, not a federal law forcing it upon them. Over time sentiment will shift organically towards abortion approval, if it's a good enough idea for Texans.

JaimeThompson 5y ago
The history of civil rights in the United States is strong evidence that doesn't work in all cases.
- sqqqqrly 5y ago
  Covid is an example where it has.
  - pavlov 5y ago
    Are you suggesting American Covid-19 policies worked well? Almost a million people died from it in this country.
    - edmcnulty101 5y ago
      Everyone is now doing what Florida and Texas have been doing all along. There's a good chance Mask mandates and COVID restrictions would have been permanent if it was federal law. The freedom of ideas given via states rights allows for a wide variety of ideas to be tested which allows the best ideas to be selected. Instead of a federal law that stamps out any ideas but one. Thank goodness the rational headed members of the Surpreme court ruled against vaccine mandates as well despite Sotomayor falsely claiming that there's 100,000 children on ventilators.
      - SamoyedFurFluff 5y ago
        > There's a good chance Mask mandates and COVID restrictions would have been permanent if it was federal law Do you have any evidence this is the case? Current federal institutions have fluctuated their guidelines, the opposite of permanency.
        edmcnulty101 5y ago
        Liberal states (and countries) were absolutely brutal with their Covid response. It took the brave governors of Texas and Florida to open up during a time of mass sensationalism and demonization to show that it wasn't as bad as the liberal states were predicting. With the Liberals taking both branches of federal congress and the presidency it doesn't take a rocket scientist to put two and two together. They tried to put through a federal vaccine mandate which was struck down by the courts on grounds of....federal overreach. And now thanks to conservative governors and states rights we can all live our normal lives again because everyone is falling in line with those conservative states who were brave enough to stand up against the crazy liberal policies. This applies to defunding the police as well. Many of the liberal states that implemented defunding the police are changing that as well. Sensational policy making appears to be a pattern with liberal states which is why states rights are beautiful. It highlights poor policy making. It is a double edged sword though because liberal states have many good policies. The point is having a variety in policies leads to richer, better governing.
        kmos17 5y ago
        There is nothing brave about republican governors in majority republican states following the misinformed party line for political brownie points on mask mandates and vaccines, in fact the exact opposite would have been brave and saved thousands of lives. Maybe now the approach makes more sense since vaccination rates are higher but it certainly did not at the time.
        edmcnulty101 5y ago
        Vaccinations rates are 65% of the population only 15% higher than 6 months ago. Deaths are between 1500 and 2000 a day across the U.S..... higher than all but 3 to 5 months of the 2 year pandemic. The people who are going for misinformed political brownie points are the Liberal states who know if they don't lift the covid restrictions during a voting year they will be removed from office which is extremely sick and hypocritical if you ask me, especially after demonizing republicans who stuck to their priniciples.
    - qzx_pierri 5y ago
      - thatswrong0 5y ago
        It’s pretty audacious to post an article as a source that actually debunks your misinformation at the bottom: > Missing context. The 6% figure used by users online to calculate COVID-19-only deaths originates from a 2020 database and represents the percentage of death certificates with COVID-19 listed as the only cause mentioned. This extrapolation is misleading, however, and doesn’t take into account that conditions listed in a death certificate may be caused by the virus itself. While a comorbidity may cause someone to be at higher risk of COVID-19, the comorbidity is not necessarily the cause of death.
- edmcnulty101 5y ago
  I'd say civil rights were the perfect example. If legal slavery was a federal law, it would still exist today. The beauty of states rights is that there's context to see why something is good or bad. Rather than the despotic federal boot that crushes any dissent.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
    I doubt that is the case. As I understand it slavery was expected to be on the outs for economic reasons anyway when the constitution was written, so abolishonists gave ground they might not have given if they knew the cotton gin would make slavery viable again. Regardless, I think slavery is a dreadful example because it leaves the definition of personhood up to individual states and that is ridiculous.
    - edmcnulty101 5y ago
      Yeah agreed. There still is a purpose of the federal government and that's enshrined in the Bill of Rights. Slavery does not even fit in to those basic fundamental Bill of Rights.
  - falcolas 5y ago
    > If legal slavery was a federal law, it would still exist today. Perhaps if the confederacy had won, given that the confederate government did institute laws to that effect upon its member states: confederate states were not allowed to aid or abet fugitive slaves. Confederate Statutes, Chapter 19, Section 50. But they didn't, and the United States government explicitly abolished slavery (despite some states wanting it, and some states not) that we don't have slavery in the US, not even in the states which embrace confederacy ideals today. And, not having slavery? That's a good thing. Thanks, US Government.
    - edmcnulty101 5y ago
      Thank the Northern states you mean.
- Pxtl 5y ago
  Imho the biggest failure is firearms control, because it makes illegal firearms trivial to move across a state border. Countries with borders and strong firearms laws can do much more than US states to keep illegal weapons out of criminal hands.
  - edmcnulty101 5y ago
    Gotta love the states that follow the second amendment of the Constitution.
SamoyedFurFluff 5y ago
Abortion is under a complex social and religious controversy that would make it difficult to presume that organic sentiment will just recognize it as good. See: the only moral abortion is my abortion. Similarly it’s very strange to advocate that at some point a majority will just hand over rights to minorities. That’s really not the practice of oppressive systems like regulating peoples bodies.
- edmcnulty101 5y ago
  > very strange to advocate that at some point a majority will just hand over rights to minorities Even harder if it's a federal law
- RhysU 5y ago
  The religious aspect always shows up in discussion. The secular case does not, with https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2021/11/29/the-secular-case-against-abortion/ https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2021/11/29/the-secul... being the only treatment of it that I have seen. Worth a read regardless of one's personal stance on the topic.
axiomsEnd 5y ago
So elected officials of one kind are making decisions based on the merit, and other elected officials are making decisions based on... Hating their voters, I guess?
ykevinator2 5y ago
I feel that states are an outdated concept based on travel time and that we should eliminate a few layers of government to save tax money. There's no reason to have one law in texas and one in new York and pay two senates and two police forces. It just feeds disunity and bloated payroll. We should have abortion or not have abortion, have pot or not have pot. It's crazy that we all go to work every day and then shell out for federal senators and state senators and county executives and town boards and village boards. It's crazy. We could cut the deficit in half if we just unified laws and chopped the payroll. Proponents of local laws are always avoiding the issue that the exceptional law protects. And I guarantee that the money saved would more than pay for the problem being addressed by the law.

JaimeThompson 5y ago

The history of civil rights in the United States is strong evidence that doesn't work in all cases.

sqqqqrly 5y ago
Covid is an example where it has.
- pavlov 5y ago
  Are you suggesting American Covid-19 policies worked well? Almost a million people died from it in this country.
  - edmcnulty101 5y ago
    Everyone is now doing what Florida and Texas have been doing all along. There's a good chance Mask mandates and COVID restrictions would have been permanent if it was federal law. The freedom of ideas given via states rights allows for a wide variety of ideas to be tested which allows the best ideas to be selected. Instead of a federal law that stamps out any ideas but one. Thank goodness the rational headed members of the Surpreme court ruled against vaccine mandates as well despite Sotomayor falsely claiming that there's 100,000 children on ventilators.
    - SamoyedFurFluff 5y ago
      > There's a good chance Mask mandates and COVID restrictions would have been permanent if it was federal law Do you have any evidence this is the case? Current federal institutions have fluctuated their guidelines, the opposite of permanency.
      - edmcnulty101 5y ago
        Liberal states (and countries) were absolutely brutal with their Covid response. It took the brave governors of Texas and Florida to open up during a time of mass sensationalism and demonization to show that it wasn't as bad as the liberal states were predicting. With the Liberals taking both branches of federal congress and the presidency it doesn't take a rocket scientist to put two and two together. They tried to put through a federal vaccine mandate which was struck down by the courts on grounds of....federal overreach. And now thanks to conservative governors and states rights we can all live our normal lives again because everyone is falling in line with those conservative states who were brave enough to stand up against the crazy liberal policies. This applies to defunding the police as well. Many of the liberal states that implemented defunding the police are changing that as well. Sensational policy making appears to be a pattern with liberal states which is why states rights are beautiful. It highlights poor policy making. It is a double edged sword though because liberal states have many good policies. The point is having a variety in policies leads to richer, better governing.
        kmos17 5y ago
        There is nothing brave about republican governors in majority republican states following the misinformed party line for political brownie points on mask mandates and vaccines, in fact the exact opposite would have been brave and saved thousands of lives. Maybe now the approach makes more sense since vaccination rates are higher but it certainly did not at the time.
        edmcnulty101 5y ago
        Vaccinations rates are 65% of the population only 15% higher than 6 months ago. Deaths are between 1500 and 2000 a day across the U.S..... higher than all but 3 to 5 months of the 2 year pandemic. The people who are going for misinformed political brownie points are the Liberal states who know if they don't lift the covid restrictions during a voting year they will be removed from office which is extremely sick and hypocritical if you ask me, especially after demonizing republicans who stuck to their priniciples.
  - qzx_pierri 5y ago
    - thatswrong0 5y ago
      It’s pretty audacious to post an article as a source that actually debunks your misinformation at the bottom: > Missing context. The 6% figure used by users online to calculate COVID-19-only deaths originates from a 2020 database and represents the percentage of death certificates with COVID-19 listed as the only cause mentioned. This extrapolation is misleading, however, and doesn’t take into account that conditions listed in a death certificate may be caused by the virus itself. While a comorbidity may cause someone to be at higher risk of COVID-19, the comorbidity is not necessarily the cause of death.
edmcnulty101 5y ago
I'd say civil rights were the perfect example. If legal slavery was a federal law, it would still exist today. The beauty of states rights is that there's context to see why something is good or bad. Rather than the despotic federal boot that crushes any dissent.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  I doubt that is the case. As I understand it slavery was expected to be on the outs for economic reasons anyway when the constitution was written, so abolishonists gave ground they might not have given if they knew the cotton gin would make slavery viable again. Regardless, I think slavery is a dreadful example because it leaves the definition of personhood up to individual states and that is ridiculous.
  - edmcnulty101 5y ago
    Yeah agreed. There still is a purpose of the federal government and that's enshrined in the Bill of Rights. Slavery does not even fit in to those basic fundamental Bill of Rights.
- falcolas 5y ago
  > If legal slavery was a federal law, it would still exist today. Perhaps if the confederacy had won, given that the confederate government did institute laws to that effect upon its member states: confederate states were not allowed to aid or abet fugitive slaves. Confederate Statutes, Chapter 19, Section 50. But they didn't, and the United States government explicitly abolished slavery (despite some states wanting it, and some states not) that we don't have slavery in the US, not even in the states which embrace confederacy ideals today. And, not having slavery? That's a good thing. Thanks, US Government.
  - edmcnulty101 5y ago
    Thank the Northern states you mean.
Pxtl 5y ago
Imho the biggest failure is firearms control, because it makes illegal firearms trivial to move across a state border. Countries with borders and strong firearms laws can do much more than US states to keep illegal weapons out of criminal hands.
- edmcnulty101 5y ago
  Gotta love the states that follow the second amendment of the Constitution.

SamoyedFurFluff 5y ago

Abortion is under a complex social and religious controversy that would make it difficult to presume that organic sentiment will just recognize it as good. See: the only moral abortion is my abortion. Similarly it’s very strange to advocate that at some point a majority will just hand over rights to minorities. That’s really not the practice of oppressive systems like regulating peoples bodies.

edmcnulty101 5y ago
> very strange to advocate that at some point a majority will just hand over rights to minorities Even harder if it's a federal law
RhysU 5y ago
The religious aspect always shows up in discussion. The secular case does not, with https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2021/11/29/the-secular-case-against-abortion/ https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2021/11/29/the-secul... being the only treatment of it that I have seen. Worth a read regardless of one's personal stance on the topic.

axiomsEnd 5y ago

So elected officials of one kind are making decisions based on the merit, and other elected officials are making decisions based on... Hating their voters, I guess?

ykevinator2 5y ago

I feel that states are an outdated concept based on travel time and that we should eliminate a few layers of government to save tax money. There's no reason to have one law in texas and one in new York and pay two senates and two police forces. It just feeds disunity and bloated payroll. We should have abortion or not have abortion, have pot or not have pot. It's crazy that we all go to work every day and then shell out for federal senators and state senators and county executives and town boards and village boards. It's crazy. We could cut the deficit in half if we just unified laws and chopped the payroll. Proponents of local laws are always avoiding the issue that the exceptional law protects. And I guarantee that the money saved would more than pay for the problem being addressed by the law.