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It's completely wrong. Ukraine is an independent nation that is not going to hurt any other country but only tries to improve the lives of their citizens. Rus

by NoPie 5y ago

It's completely wrong. Ukraine is an independent nation that is not going to hurt any other country but only tries to improve the lives of their citizens. Russia, or particularly Putin, has ambitions to force Ukraine to follow their lead. This was going to end and that's why Putin decided to attack. But his mental state that sees them as potential danger is wrong. It is a reality but still wrong.

verdverm 5y ago
Was it wrong for the Soviets to invade Poland to fight the German Nazis in WWII? We accept that people have different religious views. Is abortion completely wrong? Is it so difficult to see they have very different world views?
- NoPie 5y ago
  In the first example you are trying to insinuate that Ukrainians are Nazis. They are not. It is not about different world views but that some of those views are nonsense. As for religious views – yes, it is wrong for one religion to attack another. Crusades are wrong, especially today.
  - verdverm 5y ago
    I'm not saying they are Nazi's but many Russians do believe this. Seek to understand their frame of mind... Every country has more than 0 neo-nazis
    - NoPie 5y ago
      I understand that Putin believes that. This view is completely wrong. What else is there to understand?
- gus_massa 5y ago
  I always though Soviets invaded Poland because they wanted a chunk of it. They had a non aggression pact with the Nazis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pac...
  - verdverm 5y ago
    There were two competing thoughts on how to defend Russia from Germany, simplified... fight on your own territory, fight on someone else's territory, the second won out but failed terribly and they were forced back into their own lands
    - TheCoelacanth 5y ago
      That's nonsense. Germany and the Soviet Union cooperated to divide up Poland between themselves. It wasn't until nearly two years later that hostilities between them began.
      - verdverm 5y ago
        Our statements are not exclusive, they are both parts of the same story
        gus_massa 5y ago
        Looking at other of your comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30559634 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30559634 Is this your real opinion? I think it's interesting to discuss with people I disagree, because they may have a different point of view in some topics. I don't expect to reach an agreement in these topics that have a strong political and emotional charge, but I think it's worth having an honest discussion. If this is not your opinion, the problem is that you may be misrepresenting their point of view. You many be holding a straw man so people takes turns to punch it. And the only takeaway is that anything can be misinterpreted if someone tries hard enough, that is hardly surprising.
        verdverm 5y ago
        At this point, my opinion is that Putin miscalculated, no one predicted the European reaction, the West has opportunity for better long-term outcomes, and there is little that the West will do to minimize the suffering in Ukraine at the current point in time. The West is not ready to engage in all out warfare with Russia. Whether the West will lean into this opportunity remains to be seen. Right now, I'm spending time gaining as many points of view as possible to gain understanding where I lack it. But it is obvious that there are many very different world views between the countries of the world and the generations of citizens in each.

by NoPie 5y ago

verdverm 5y ago

Was it wrong for the Soviets to invade Poland to fight the German Nazis in WWII? We accept that people have different religious views. Is abortion completely wrong? Is it so difficult to see they have very different world views?

NoPie 5y ago
In the first example you are trying to insinuate that Ukrainians are Nazis. They are not. It is not about different world views but that some of those views are nonsense. As for religious views – yes, it is wrong for one religion to attack another. Crusades are wrong, especially today.
- verdverm 5y ago
  I'm not saying they are Nazi's but many Russians do believe this. Seek to understand their frame of mind... Every country has more than 0 neo-nazis
  - NoPie 5y ago
    I understand that Putin believes that. This view is completely wrong. What else is there to understand?
gus_massa 5y ago
I always though Soviets invaded Poland because they wanted a chunk of it. They had a non aggression pact with the Nazis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pact https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pac...
- verdverm 5y ago
  There were two competing thoughts on how to defend Russia from Germany, simplified... fight on your own territory, fight on someone else's territory, the second won out but failed terribly and they were forced back into their own lands
  - TheCoelacanth 5y ago
    That's nonsense. Germany and the Soviet Union cooperated to divide up Poland between themselves. It wasn't until nearly two years later that hostilities between them began.
    - verdverm 5y ago
      Our statements are not exclusive, they are both parts of the same story
      - gus_massa 5y ago
        Looking at other of your comments https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30559634 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30559634 Is this your real opinion? I think it's interesting to discuss with people I disagree, because they may have a different point of view in some topics. I don't expect to reach an agreement in these topics that have a strong political and emotional charge, but I think it's worth having an honest discussion. If this is not your opinion, the problem is that you may be misrepresenting their point of view. You many be holding a straw man so people takes turns to punch it. And the only takeaway is that anything can be misinterpreted if someone tries hard enough, that is hardly surprising.
        verdverm 5y ago
        At this point, my opinion is that Putin miscalculated, no one predicted the European reaction, the West has opportunity for better long-term outcomes, and there is little that the West will do to minimize the suffering in Ukraine at the current point in time. The West is not ready to engage in all out warfare with Russia. Whether the West will lean into this opportunity remains to be seen. Right now, I'm spending time gaining as many points of view as possible to gain understanding where I lack it. But it is obvious that there are many very different world views between the countries of the world and the generations of citizens in each.