5 ms·

Yes, i work on exactly this now, for years, many failures. Co2 output from mushroom is the input to cannabis. Temperature differential is a real problem.

monetus 5y ago
Find any mycelium that help the root systems?
- samstave 5y ago
  AFAIK all mycelium helps root systems, from the symbiotic relation, but in indoor, hydro type grows it might be harder. What would be interesting is the combination of vertical mushroom grows and vertical hydro culture. Imagine a tube/tower of mycelium, but also allowing the cannabis to grw out of the tube/tower... and having the root systems intertwined, but the problem therein is that the diff in the mycelium being perennial as opposed to the cannabis being annual...
  - monetus 5y ago
    I've experimented with vertical farming greens and mushrooms together; figuring out the schedule for the different colors of light can be a bit of a pain, but I used LEDs. - I stacked tote bins that I had drimmeled to interlock with eachother like a greenhouse. I don't think hydro would be possible without a super specialized fungus. If you ward off infections, regular hardwood based edible mushrooms work in dirt with vegetables. The mycelium doesn't seem to particularly help though. Greens and most edible mushrooms come from different substrates. I've yet to really look, but I suspect most desirable mushrooms won't be the best mutualists. There will probably be some that are more than a little valuable in balancing a polyculture though. I really want to find those pairs and groups, like we've discovered in say oaks or orchids, where they seemed to have evolved together. Aside: Mushrooms are perennial but the mycelium doesn't always die away. And some are selfish in not so mutualistic ways too.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - elasticventures 5y ago
      the co2 from the mycelium, let it build up, then periodically cycle into your vertical farm to increase the co2 concentration -- then watch your vegetables or whatever grow bigger!
  - solomonb 5y ago
    Nitpick, but there are certainly parasitic fungi which do not have a symbiotic relationship with plants. Also only some fungi have a mycorrhizal relationship with plants. Most are saprophytic meaning they decompose dead organic material. This is of course extremely beneficial and required for a closed ecosystem, but the symbiotic relationship isn't as direct as mycorrhizal fungi and is really part of a much more complex network of soil organisms that all need to be at play. Simply introducing a saprophytic fungi to your soil will probably not result in any benefits to your indoor cannabis garden.
  - elasticventures 5y ago
    My understanding is that Mycelium mostly helps with nutrient motility, moving them across roots of the plants. Potentially increasing bioavailability. Some Eukaryotes are also reported to my mycellial connection with the plant (i.e. merge with the plants) some sort of forest underweb sort of thing, but I think that would be very difficult to reproduce insitu. Eukaryotes are amazing but also so diverse they defy classification.
samstave 5y ago
I would like to know more, I have worked in Cannabis (built out one of the few type 7 extraction labs in California... my neighbor and friend is the DA for the DCC in California, and I have close contact with some of the largest outdoor growers in the state... I'd be interested in hearing more and figuring out how to work more on this topic.
cwkoss 5y ago
What is the temperature differential problem? (I think many mushrooms are pretty happy fruiting at ~70F room temperature, as is cannabis. Is it that the grow lights fight the humidity needs of the mushrooms? Or do the species of mushrooms you're using have different temperature needs? Or the cannabis grows faster as temperature increases? I've only worked with shiitake and oyster, and got poor results with one lions mane attempt so... definitely not an expert)
- AngryData 5y ago
  I just want to add, if people are upgrading to LEDs they will have a drop in yield unless they raise room temperatures to 80F or more so there is still a temperature differential, although to me it seems relatively minor especially using heat exchangers. The high efficiency of LED grow lights means leaf temperatures are much lower so room temperature must go up to compensate.
  - cwkoss 5y ago
    I wonder if the root zone needs the warmth too, or if its just the aerial parts of the plant that needs the warmth for optimal growth. Maybe plastic with holes for each stem could be used to insulate the aerial airspace from the root airspace and then a small heatpump could make that 10F differential with relatively low power cost.
  - samstave 5y ago
    Super interesting. I wonder what the baseline is btwn the two ; How dependent on heat is the "fruitful" nature of the plant vs the subsitance livability of the plant? i.e. Min temp for survival vs min temp to fruit and the balance between... What is the coldest one can keep a plant while maintaining max fruiting output?
  - samstave 5y ago
    holy crap. Just hear me out ; --- What if the human genome code diffs based on pro-longed temp differentials in host biology (meaning if the in-utero mother was in a prolonged colder climate, which altered the passed on DNA) So"cooking" dna is a real thing, May one be able to "calcify" information into DNA based on temp? Science fiction galore!

monetus 5y ago

Find any mycelium that help the root systems?

samstave 5y ago
AFAIK all mycelium helps root systems, from the symbiotic relation, but in indoor, hydro type grows it might be harder. What would be interesting is the combination of vertical mushroom grows and vertical hydro culture. Imagine a tube/tower of mycelium, but also allowing the cannabis to grw out of the tube/tower... and having the root systems intertwined, but the problem therein is that the diff in the mycelium being perennial as opposed to the cannabis being annual...
- monetus 5y ago
  I've experimented with vertical farming greens and mushrooms together; figuring out the schedule for the different colors of light can be a bit of a pain, but I used LEDs. - I stacked tote bins that I had drimmeled to interlock with eachother like a greenhouse. I don't think hydro would be possible without a super specialized fungus. If you ward off infections, regular hardwood based edible mushrooms work in dirt with vegetables. The mycelium doesn't seem to particularly help though. Greens and most edible mushrooms come from different substrates. I've yet to really look, but I suspect most desirable mushrooms won't be the best mutualists. There will probably be some that are more than a little valuable in balancing a polyculture though. I really want to find those pairs and groups, like we've discovered in say oaks or orchids, where they seemed to have evolved together. Aside: Mushrooms are perennial but the mycelium doesn't always die away. And some are selfish in not so mutualistic ways too.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - elasticventures 5y ago
    the co2 from the mycelium, let it build up, then periodically cycle into your vertical farm to increase the co2 concentration -- then watch your vegetables or whatever grow bigger!
- solomonb 5y ago
  Nitpick, but there are certainly parasitic fungi which do not have a symbiotic relationship with plants. Also only some fungi have a mycorrhizal relationship with plants. Most are saprophytic meaning they decompose dead organic material. This is of course extremely beneficial and required for a closed ecosystem, but the symbiotic relationship isn't as direct as mycorrhizal fungi and is really part of a much more complex network of soil organisms that all need to be at play. Simply introducing a saprophytic fungi to your soil will probably not result in any benefits to your indoor cannabis garden.
- elasticventures 5y ago
  My understanding is that Mycelium mostly helps with nutrient motility, moving them across roots of the plants. Potentially increasing bioavailability. Some Eukaryotes are also reported to my mycellial connection with the plant (i.e. merge with the plants) some sort of forest underweb sort of thing, but I think that would be very difficult to reproduce insitu. Eukaryotes are amazing but also so diverse they defy classification.

samstave 5y ago

I would like to know more, I have worked in Cannabis (built out one of the few type 7 extraction labs in California... my neighbor and friend is the DA for the DCC in California, and I have close contact with some of the largest outdoor growers in the state... I'd be interested in hearing more and figuring out how to work more on this topic.

cwkoss 5y ago

What is the temperature differential problem? (I think many mushrooms are pretty happy fruiting at ~70F room temperature, as is cannabis. Is it that the grow lights fight the humidity needs of the mushrooms? Or do the species of mushrooms you're using have different temperature needs? Or the cannabis grows faster as temperature increases? I've only worked with shiitake and oyster, and got poor results with one lions mane attempt so... definitely not an expert)

AngryData 5y ago
I just want to add, if people are upgrading to LEDs they will have a drop in yield unless they raise room temperatures to 80F or more so there is still a temperature differential, although to me it seems relatively minor especially using heat exchangers. The high efficiency of LED grow lights means leaf temperatures are much lower so room temperature must go up to compensate.
- cwkoss 5y ago
  I wonder if the root zone needs the warmth too, or if its just the aerial parts of the plant that needs the warmth for optimal growth. Maybe plastic with holes for each stem could be used to insulate the aerial airspace from the root airspace and then a small heatpump could make that 10F differential with relatively low power cost.
- samstave 5y ago
  Super interesting. I wonder what the baseline is btwn the two ; How dependent on heat is the "fruitful" nature of the plant vs the subsitance livability of the plant? i.e. Min temp for survival vs min temp to fruit and the balance between... What is the coldest one can keep a plant while maintaining max fruiting output?
- samstave 5y ago
  holy crap. Just hear me out ; --- What if the human genome code diffs based on pro-longed temp differentials in host biology (meaning if the in-utero mother was in a prolonged colder climate, which altered the passed on DNA) So"cooking" dna is a real thing, May one be able to "calcify" information into DNA based on temp? Science fiction galore!