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The problem with panslavism is that Russians would have majority, and Russian states were almost always authoritharian and oppressive.
by ajuc 5y ago
The problem with panslavism is that Russians would have majority, and Russian states were almost always authoritharian and oppressive.
- wheelerof4te 5y agoWe had rather brutal monarchies in the West, too. Colonialism was not altruistic trip around the globe. Almost all former European monarchies, from England to Belgium, were authoritarian imperialistic countries.
- ajuc 5y agoThere're different levels of authoritarianism and Russia was usually at the far end. Especially compared to the other Slavic countries it annexed like Novogrod Republic of Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth which had parliaments and elections in 1500s. But even compared to the absolutist monarchies of the west Russia was more authoritarian. For example serfdom was only abolished in Russia in 1861.
- krzyk 5y agoDon't look so far the the west, you have an example of non authoritarian monarchies in central Europe (e.g. Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth where you had a second constitution in the world, just after the US one, a parliament).
- Zickzack 5y agoThe Ukraine offers the Orlyk constitution from 1710. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Pylyp_Orlyk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Pylyp_Orlyk
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- stared 5y agoThere is a continuous history of autocratic rulers, Tzars named one way or another. And an as long history of dissidents. Yet, this idea would be dangerous even with very different cultures - vide "Ein Reich".
- blip54321 5y agoLet's bring back to Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, only under a more inclusive name. Russia wasn't always authoritarian, though. Before the Mongols, it was a bunch of independent, freedom-loving cities. Sort of like the American Wild West. I feel like we need a new experiment in inclusive governance, and that Slavic countries are the place to do it.
- unsigner 5y agoYep, it’s the Three Seas Initiative. Bring it on! We’ll take on board some non-Slavic speakers from Hungary, the Baltics, Romania, and Albania.
- blip54321 5y agoThat's a great name for the new entity. Three seas works well in Slavic languages, and is neutral. Austria should be replaced by Ukraine and Moldova, though. Austria definitely doesn't belong. Ukraine and Poland really do belong together. Ukraine is more faithful to traditional Polish culture than Poland. Poland westernized a lot since joining the EU and NATO, and Ukranian cultural influence would be awesome. Conversely, Ukraine could use some economic assistance, where Poland's economy has exploded, for much the same reason of NATO/EU.
- int_19h 5y agoPolish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was hardly exemplar, either, given the state of the peasants there, and religious persecution of non-Catholics. Grand Duchy of Lithuania is a better model, IMO - a state with a Lithuanian pagan ruler, and a mix of pagan, Catholic, and Orthodox elites and population all living together.
- blip54321 5y agoLet's break this down piece-by-piece. (1) The Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth had elected kings and a parliament. It was a republic to the same degree as Rome or some of the more democratic Greek city-states. The only people who could vote were nobles, but nobles were about 10% of the population. That's about on-par with with Athens or the Roman Empire. Even in the US, only white landowners could vote when it was first founded. That's not too dissimilar from the Polish nobility. (2) Jews emigrated to the Commonwealth from all over Europe for better treatment. Good treatment? No. Better treatment? Without a doubt. The Commonwealth wasn't a modern enlightened democracy, but this was 1600, not 1900. It did incredibly well for 1600.