3 ms·

Wikipedia is contradictory. The intercept is Russian propaganda. The fact that the US Congress at one point labeled Azov a white supremacist group is contradi

Wikipedia is contradictory. The intercept is Russian propaganda. The fact that the US Congress at one point labeled Azov a white supremacist group is contradictory? Oliver Stone's 2017 doc "Ukraine on Fire" [1], painstakingly documenting Azov's Nazi roots and it's glorification of Nazis who led massacres of Jews and Poles in WW2 is also propaganda? The fact that Stephen Bandera, one of those Nazis and perpetrators of the Holocaust in Ukraine is considered a hero by Azov and is revered and honored by the UKRAINIAN state is also Russian propaganda. The evidence and facts are overwhelming that Nazism is now embedded into the fabric of a modern state. I myself ignored this for a long time and that makes me sick. [1] https://youtu.be/YfC7s1A1KjI https://youtu.be/YfC7s1A1KjI [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stepan_Bandera https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stepan_Bandera

pelasaco 5y ago
I understand that you as proud Indian and Western hater, will do anything to support Russia in this War. At least while that's the official position from India. The relationship from West Ukraine and the Nazis isn't hard to understand. They had to choose a side and they wanted everything but the soviets. The figure of Bandera is a controversial one, but I think this piece of text from the Wikipedia article (linked by you) makes it clear that the facts are more complex than you are saying: "Bandera cultivated German military circles favorable to Ukrainian independence, and organized OUN expeditionary groups. When Nazi Germany invaded the Soviet Union, he prepared the 30 June 1941 Proclamation of Ukrainian statehood in Lviv, pledging to work with Nazi Germany. For his refusal to rescind the decree, Bandera was arrested by the Gestapo, which put him under house arrest on 5 July 1941, and later between 1942 and 1943[7] sent him to the Sachsenhausen concentration camp. In 1944, with Germany rapidly losing ground in the war in the face of the advancing Allied armies, Bandera was released in the hope that he would be instrumental in deterring the advancing Soviet forces. He set up the headquarters of the re-established Ukrainian Supreme Liberation Council, which worked underground." So his goal was clearly one: Ukrainian independence. From this point of view, I can understand why some circles think good about him. Actually the whole Wikipedia article about him, makes clear his role and reasoning. From that, and his Biography what do you think was extremely bad? What side I would pick? I'm glad that I didn't have to pick one. As Jewish, my family left Germany and Poland after the WWI towards South America. Why I think that it is just Russian Propaganda? Because to bring those "factoids" now is just to justify the invasion of the Ukraine. There is no other intention other than be used in the Information Warfare.
- unmole 5y ago
  > I understand that you as proud Indian and Western hater, will do anything to support Russia in this War. Which part of the comment supported Russia? > At least while that's the official position from India. Here is India's official position as stated in the Explanation of Vote: https://twitter.com/ambtstirumurti/status/1499073038154874881/photo/2 https://twitter.com/ambtstirumurti/status/149907303815487488... Which part of that supports Russia? > So his goal was clearly one: Ukrainian independence. That is actually a position Indians can fully understand and appreciate. And right now Indians care about getting their citizens stranded in Ukraine back home, ensuring that shipments of potash from Russia are not disrupted and not antagonizing their largest weapons supplier. > Why I think that it is just Russian Propaganda? Because to bring those "factoids" now is just to justify the invasion of the Ukraine. There is no other intention other than be used in the Information Warfare. Again, TFA is about changing the rules of censorship. FB previously considered any support of the Azov Battalion unacceptable because of the neo-Nazi connection. Was FB also a part of Russian propaganda?
  - pelasaco 5y ago
    > Was FB also a part of Russian propaganda? In fact it was an instrument, yes: https://www.npr.org/2022/02/28/1083633239/facebook-and-tiktok-block-russian-state-media-in-europe https://www.npr.org/2022/02/28/1083633239/facebook-and-tikto...
    - unmole 5y ago
      For the third time, TFA is about Facebook modifying it's policy to allow praise of an organisation it previously blocked for having neo-Nazi associations. Rather than address that in anyway, your response has been to claim it's all Russian propaganda and now to link to a completely irrelevant article about Facebook blocking Russian state media.
      - pelasaco 5y ago
        You finished your last answer with a question. The question was answered. TFA don't define in which directions the discussions go. We, commenters, do. Feel free to just ignore further comments.

pelasaco 5y ago

I understand that you as proud Indian and Western hater, will do anything to support Russia in this War. At least while that's the official position from India. The relationship from West Ukraine and the Nazis isn't hard to understand. They had to choose a side and they wanted everything but the soviets. The figure of Bandera is a controversial one, but I think this piece of text from the Wikipedia article (linked by you) makes it clear that the facts are more complex than you are saying: "Bandera cultivated German military circles favorable to Ukrainian independence, and organized OUN expeditionary groups. When Nazi Germany invaded the Soviet Union, he prepared the 30 June 1941 Proclamation of Ukrainian statehood in Lviv, pledging to work with Nazi Germany. For his refusal to rescind the decree, Bandera was arrested by the Gestapo, which put him under house arrest on 5 July 1941, and later between 1942 and 1943[7] sent him to the Sachsenhausen concentration camp. In 1944, with Germany rapidly losing ground in the war in the face of the advancing Allied armies, Bandera was released in the hope that he would be instrumental in deterring the advancing Soviet forces. He set up the headquarters of the re-established Ukrainian Supreme Liberation Council, which worked underground." So his goal was clearly one: Ukrainian independence. From this point of view, I can understand why some circles think good about him. Actually the whole Wikipedia article about him, makes clear his role and reasoning. From that, and his Biography what do you think was extremely bad? What side I would pick? I'm glad that I didn't have to pick one. As Jewish, my family left Germany and Poland after the WWI towards South America. Why I think that it is just Russian Propaganda? Because to bring those "factoids" now is just to justify the invasion of the Ukraine. There is no other intention other than be used in the Information Warfare.

unmole 5y ago
> I understand that you as proud Indian and Western hater, will do anything to support Russia in this War. Which part of the comment supported Russia? > At least while that's the official position from India. Here is India's official position as stated in the Explanation of Vote: https://twitter.com/ambtstirumurti/status/1499073038154874881/photo/2 https://twitter.com/ambtstirumurti/status/149907303815487488... Which part of that supports Russia? > So his goal was clearly one: Ukrainian independence. That is actually a position Indians can fully understand and appreciate. And right now Indians care about getting their citizens stranded in Ukraine back home, ensuring that shipments of potash from Russia are not disrupted and not antagonizing their largest weapons supplier. > Why I think that it is just Russian Propaganda? Because to bring those "factoids" now is just to justify the invasion of the Ukraine. There is no other intention other than be used in the Information Warfare. Again, TFA is about changing the rules of censorship. FB previously considered any support of the Azov Battalion unacceptable because of the neo-Nazi connection. Was FB also a part of Russian propaganda?
- pelasaco 5y ago
  > Was FB also a part of Russian propaganda? In fact it was an instrument, yes: https://www.npr.org/2022/02/28/1083633239/facebook-and-tiktok-block-russian-state-media-in-europe https://www.npr.org/2022/02/28/1083633239/facebook-and-tikto...
  - unmole 5y ago
    For the third time, TFA is about Facebook modifying it's policy to allow praise of an organisation it previously blocked for having neo-Nazi associations. Rather than address that in anyway, your response has been to claim it's all Russian propaganda and now to link to a completely irrelevant article about Facebook blocking Russian state media.
    - pelasaco 5y ago
      You finished your last answer with a question. The question was answered. TFA don't define in which directions the discussions go. We, commenters, do. Feel free to just ignore further comments.