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> If your kids are experiencing horror and mental problems from an antigen test, you’re the one causing it. This, though, is a crude overgeneralisation. Swizzl

> If your kids are experiencing horror and mental problems from an antigen test, you’re the one causing it. This, though, is a crude overgeneralisation. Swizzling a swab in their nostrils (or around the back of their throat) could well cause instant, significant distress if they have a hypersensitivity disorder or other trauma. It's necessary, it's appropriate, it's the right thing to do, and parents should try to do it. But you're making a crude assumption about the difficulty of something that some very good parents of children with a variety of challenges will tell you may not be possible, especially with a very young child. I am pro-vaccination, pro-testing, pro- whatever sane measures the appropriate health authority deem necessary. But just because they are necessary and appropriate in the aggregate does not make them easy and breezy at the individual level. I am amazed at what some parents have stoically put up with and what kids will adapt to -- they are as I say, astonishingly resilient in general -- but not all kids can adapt and not all parents necessarily find it easy to medicalise the relationship with their children.

dpark 5y ago
> Swizzling a swab in their nostrils (…) could well cause instant, significant distress if they have a hypersensitivity disorder or other trauma. This is like saying that it’s absolute torture to make kids walk up two flights of stairs, and then when rebutted by someone else saying the kids will be fine, trotting out that some kids are in wheelchairs. Yeah, some kids are special needs. It is intellectually dishonest to trot that out as an opposition to a general thing. Some kids legitimately cannot wear masks for various reasons. Some kids probably can’t handle being swabbed nasally. And some kids can’t walk up stairs. This is why we have accommodations while general guidelines apply to kids who do not have these uncommon issues. We still expect kids to learn math and to run around in PE even though some kids unfortunately can’t do either of those things. > or around the back of their throat I don’t know anyone who has ever swabbed their kid’s throat for COVID. Maybe that’s a thing some places. Sounds unpleasant although most kids would survive that just fine, too.
- unfocussed_mike 5y ago
  > This is like saying that it’s absolute torture to make kids walk up two flights of stairs, and then when rebutted by someone else saying the kids will be fine, trotting out that some kids are in wheelchairs. No, it's not, because you're talking about an unusual and gross medical test. A literal, very personal intrusion, poking something far up where kids are told not to poke things. Not walking upstairs. > I don’t know anyone who has ever swabbed their kid’s throat for COVID. Maybe that’s a thing some places. Sounds unpleasant although most kids would survive that just fine, too. Most test kits don't require it; it's still the best way to get an accurate result, though (and it's very definitely part of the adult routine that they may have witnessed). Kids may have experienced the throat swab in a medical situation and be very resistant to the swab full stop. > Yeah, some kids are special needs. It is intellectually dishonest to trot that out as an opposition to a general thing. But it's intellectually honest to generalise saying "if your kids experience trauma, you caused it"? You're proud of this argument so I'll leave it at that.
  - ceejayoz 5y ago
    > No, it's not, because you're talking about an unusual and gross medical test. A literal, very personal intrusion, poking something far up where kids are told not to poke things. Not walking upstairs. The same is true when I clean my kids' ears. > Most test kits don't require it; it's still the best way to get an accurate result, though... It is explicitly recommended against by the FDA. https://twitter.com/US_FDA/status/1479548116684709890 https://twitter.com/US_FDA/status/1479548116684709890
    - unfocussed_mike 5y ago
      It's explicitly part of the instructions in the UK tests.
      - ceejayoz 5y ago
        That's an argument for changing which tests are being bought, then.

dpark 5y ago

> Swizzling a swab in their nostrils (…) could well cause instant, significant distress if they have a hypersensitivity disorder or other trauma. This is like saying that it’s absolute torture to make kids walk up two flights of stairs, and then when rebutted by someone else saying the kids will be fine, trotting out that some kids are in wheelchairs. Yeah, some kids are special needs. It is intellectually dishonest to trot that out as an opposition to a general thing. Some kids legitimately cannot wear masks for various reasons. Some kids probably can’t handle being swabbed nasally. And some kids can’t walk up stairs. This is why we have accommodations while general guidelines apply to kids who do not have these uncommon issues. We still expect kids to learn math and to run around in PE even though some kids unfortunately can’t do either of those things. > or around the back of their throat I don’t know anyone who has ever swabbed their kid’s throat for COVID. Maybe that’s a thing some places. Sounds unpleasant although most kids would survive that just fine, too.

unfocussed_mike 5y ago
> This is like saying that it’s absolute torture to make kids walk up two flights of stairs, and then when rebutted by someone else saying the kids will be fine, trotting out that some kids are in wheelchairs. No, it's not, because you're talking about an unusual and gross medical test. A literal, very personal intrusion, poking something far up where kids are told not to poke things. Not walking upstairs. > I don’t know anyone who has ever swabbed their kid’s throat for COVID. Maybe that’s a thing some places. Sounds unpleasant although most kids would survive that just fine, too. Most test kits don't require it; it's still the best way to get an accurate result, though (and it's very definitely part of the adult routine that they may have witnessed). Kids may have experienced the throat swab in a medical situation and be very resistant to the swab full stop. > Yeah, some kids are special needs. It is intellectually dishonest to trot that out as an opposition to a general thing. But it's intellectually honest to generalise saying "if your kids experience trauma, you caused it"? You're proud of this argument so I'll leave it at that.
- ceejayoz 5y ago
  > No, it's not, because you're talking about an unusual and gross medical test. A literal, very personal intrusion, poking something far up where kids are told not to poke things. Not walking upstairs. The same is true when I clean my kids' ears. > Most test kits don't require it; it's still the best way to get an accurate result, though... It is explicitly recommended against by the FDA. https://twitter.com/US_FDA/status/1479548116684709890 https://twitter.com/US_FDA/status/1479548116684709890
  - unfocussed_mike 5y ago
    It's explicitly part of the instructions in the UK tests.
    - ceejayoz 5y ago
      That's an argument for changing which tests are being bought, then.