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I really appreciate the initiative but I dislike the form: should be way simpler. This may justify the low participation on such a relevant issue. Each informa

I really appreciate the initiative but I dislike the form: should be way simpler. This may justify the low participation on such a relevant issue. Each informal proposal could have maximum of 10(?) items/lines to be easy to reason about. Russians/Ukranians/Other people could vote, results would be percentual. (e.g.: 56% of Russian voters, 32% Ukranians and 65% other voters agree with this proposal). I believe, the real negotiators would take a look as source of ideas, the media has been fundamental in this war. Simplistically, as an outsider, I would propose: 1. Immediate cease fire. 2. Crimea and separatist territories get independence and are free to join Russia. 3. Ukraine joins EU. 4. Ukraine stays neutral and out of NATO.

KingOfCoders 5y ago
3. and 4. What if the EU builds an army?
- waffleiron 5y ago
  Secondly, like NATO the EU has it's own mutual defense clause contained in the treaty of Lisbon.
- galfarragem 5y ago
  Ukraine stays neutral unless Russia is an EU ally/member also. Post-Putin Russia should integrate somehow EU. I believe young generations would rejoice. "A day will come when you — France, Russia, Italy, England, Germany — all you nations of the continent will merge, without losing your distinct qualities and your glorious individuality, in a close and higher unity to form a European brotherhood, just as Normandy, Brittany, Burgundy, Lorraine, Alsace, all our provinces are merged together in France." -- Victor Hugo (1849)
  - KingOfCoders 5y ago
    So I assume Russia will join the EU 13 years after being utterly destroyed as Germany has been joining the EU in 1958 - we have only very limited data points here. Though because of the Russian scare of the 50s perhaps Germany was let in earlier then one would have guessed. We would need an external threat like China that unites the EU with Russia, something very unlikely from the current point in time.

KingOfCoders 5y ago

3. and 4. What if the EU builds an army?

waffleiron 5y ago
Secondly, like NATO the EU has it's own mutual defense clause contained in the treaty of Lisbon.
galfarragem 5y ago
Ukraine stays neutral unless Russia is an EU ally/member also. Post-Putin Russia should integrate somehow EU. I believe young generations would rejoice. "A day will come when you — France, Russia, Italy, England, Germany — all you nations of the continent will merge, without losing your distinct qualities and your glorious individuality, in a close and higher unity to form a European brotherhood, just as Normandy, Brittany, Burgundy, Lorraine, Alsace, all our provinces are merged together in France." -- Victor Hugo (1849)
- KingOfCoders 5y ago
  So I assume Russia will join the EU 13 years after being utterly destroyed as Germany has been joining the EU in 1958 - we have only very limited data points here. Though because of the Russian scare of the 50s perhaps Germany was let in earlier then one would have guessed. We would need an external threat like China that unites the EU with Russia, something very unlikely from the current point in time.