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Again, I have no first-hand experience with this device so I can only infer things from the articles and documents we have available. I fear I am being overly

Again, I have no first-hand experience with this device so I can only infer things from the articles and documents we have available. I fear I am being overly pedantic here, but to me, "override" implies that the device is circumventing sensor readings or physical interlocks or something similar to manipulate the machine's mechanisms to doing something they weren't intended to. However, I've see no indication of that. The device is described as, essentially, a second control panel. Anything the Kytch device can do is something an operator could already do by pushing buttons on the factory-installed control panel. The difference is that it interprets the data to be easier to understand, and provides remote monitoring. It's really no different than plugging a ScanGauge into a car's ODB-II port. The ScanGauge can tell you all sorts of things about the state of the engine, but it isn't going to stop the brakes from working. I remember reading that Wired article when it first came out. Near the beginning, it says: > As O'Sullivan says, this menu isn’t documented in any owner's manual for the Taylor digital ice cream machines This is demonstrably false. It's clearly documented on page 22 of the service manual: https://static-pt.com/modelManual/TAF-C602_spm.pdf https://static-pt.com/modelManual/TAF-C602_spm.pdf Frankly, the manuals Taylor has made for these machines are quite thorough and well written. The claims from the article about how this is "secret" and "undisclosed" seem disingenuous when a simple Google search reveals evidence to the contrary. I suppose one could argue that a "service manual" is not an "owner's manual", but that seems overly pedantic (even to me!).

everforward 5y ago
> This is demonstrably false. It's clearly documented on page 22 of the service manual: https://static-pt.com/modelManual/TAF-C602_spm.pdf https://static-pt.com/modelManual/TAF-C602_spm.pdf I can't find it from Taylor, though. I think the point they're making with the "secret" is that the manufacturer won't give them to you. The 3rd party copies are likely illegal; I would presume the service manual is copyrighted. > Anything the Kytch device can do is something an operator could already do by pushing buttons on the factory-installed control panel. The difference is that it interprets the data to be easier to understand, and provides remote monitoring. It does allow access to things that users weren't meant to be able to access, and some of them are dangerous. E.g. you can change the temperature of the boil cycle down to something too low to kill bacteria. > It's really no different than plugging a ScanGauge into a car's ODB-II port. The ScanGauge can tell you all sorts of things about the state of the engine, but it isn't going to stop the brakes from working. The ScanGauge can't actually change any parameters, afaik. This is closer to replacing the ECU. It gives you more data on what you car is doing, but also gives you the option to tune the engine. You can either make it more efficient, or you can destroy the engine, depending on how you tune the settings. Except in this case, "destroy the engine" roughly translates to "give a bunch of people listeria infections". In my opinion, it's unreasonable for McDonald's to block off access to the data, but it is reasonable for them to not want franchisee's to be able to change parameters like the boil temperature, or how frequently cleanings need to be done (which is another parameter in that secret menu). The whole situation is a mess, because I can't see a way to allow access to the data without access to the whole secret menu, other than replacing all the hardware. I think I saw McDonald's trying to sell their own device on that front; likely because then they can ensure that the parameters aren't exposed. The C602 was released in 2003 afaict. I don't think this was a malicious decision so much as no one in 2003 predicting that it would be beneficial (or cost-effective) to have a WiFi/Bluetooth remote data port. That was 4 years before the iPhone, and interestingly, also only 5 years after the first consumer bluetooth device was unveiled. I don't find it shocking that a behemoth like McDonald's isn't putting nascent technology in an ice cream machine they plan to use for decades.

everforward 5y ago

> This is demonstrably false. It's clearly documented on page 22 of the service manual: https://static-pt.com/modelManual/TAF-C602_spm.pdf https://static-pt.com/modelManual/TAF-C602_spm.pdf I can't find it from Taylor, though. I think the point they're making with the "secret" is that the manufacturer won't give them to you. The 3rd party copies are likely illegal; I would presume the service manual is copyrighted. > Anything the Kytch device can do is something an operator could already do by pushing buttons on the factory-installed control panel. The difference is that it interprets the data to be easier to understand, and provides remote monitoring. It does allow access to things that users weren't meant to be able to access, and some of them are dangerous. E.g. you can change the temperature of the boil cycle down to something too low to kill bacteria. > It's really no different than plugging a ScanGauge into a car's ODB-II port. The ScanGauge can tell you all sorts of things about the state of the engine, but it isn't going to stop the brakes from working. The ScanGauge can't actually change any parameters, afaik. This is closer to replacing the ECU. It gives you more data on what you car is doing, but also gives you the option to tune the engine. You can either make it more efficient, or you can destroy the engine, depending on how you tune the settings. Except in this case, "destroy the engine" roughly translates to "give a bunch of people listeria infections". In my opinion, it's unreasonable for McDonald's to block off access to the data, but it is reasonable for them to not want franchisee's to be able to change parameters like the boil temperature, or how frequently cleanings need to be done (which is another parameter in that secret menu). The whole situation is a mess, because I can't see a way to allow access to the data without access to the whole secret menu, other than replacing all the hardware. I think I saw McDonald's trying to sell their own device on that front; likely because then they can ensure that the parameters aren't exposed. The C602 was released in 2003 afaict. I don't think this was a malicious decision so much as no one in 2003 predicting that it would be beneficial (or cost-effective) to have a WiFi/Bluetooth remote data port. That was 4 years before the iPhone, and interestingly, also only 5 years after the first consumer bluetooth device was unveiled. I don't find it shocking that a behemoth like McDonald's isn't putting nascent technology in an ice cream machine they plan to use for decades.