9 ms·

They are ‘civilised’ and ‘look like us’: the racist coverage of Ukraine

sinyug 5y ago
> In Austria, Chancellor Karl Nehammer stated that “of course we will take in refugees, if necessary”. Meanwhile, just last fall and in his then-role as interior minister, Nehammer was known as a hardliner against resettling Afghan refugees in Austria and as a politician who insisted on Austria’s right to forcibly deport rejected Afghan asylum seekers, even if that meant returning them to the Taliban. “It’s different in Ukraine than in countries like Afghanistan,” he told Austrian TV. “We’re talking about neighborhood help.” But he wants the entire world to get involved in this "neighborhood war." Black and brown countries should take note of this conflict very seriously. Western imperialism never died. The West is perfectly okay with black on black and brown on brown violence. It is only in the case of black/brown on white or white on white violence that they interfere with such ferocity.
- rasz 5y ago
  Its about the contrast of men in track suits throwing rocks and climbing fences versus women with children.
  - sinyug 5y ago
    > Its about the contrast of men in track suits throwing rocks and climbing fences versus women with children. He is openly talking about neighborhood help. All the media reports are full of "they look like us," "blue eyes" and "blond hair." I am not passing moral judgment on his choices; cultural incompatibility will eventually lead to conflict. I am simply pointing out the hypocrisy of demanding that the whole world join the "isolate Russia" project while simultaneously claiming that it is a neighborhood affair.
    - nojokes 5y ago
      Perhaps you do not realize this but when you live in homogeneous community, differences on other dimension amplify. Saying that they look like us might simply mean that people should put other prejudices aside.
- vanusa 5y ago
  - ashwagary 5y ago
    >This isn't "white on white violence", and it is racist to cast it in such terms. This is how conflicts are framed when black people are involved in the US. "white on white crime" sounds like a fair description even if it's a somewhat vague term.
- jimbob45 5y ago
  An alternative take would be that the West is more okay with 3rd-world country violence rather than 1st-world country violence (like Ukraine). It happens to be the case that all countries that have recently seen conflict without significant US intervention were both brown and 3rd-world. I would assume that if the Saudis, Indians, Israelis, or others were to see this same type of conflict, you'd see a much greater US commitment. If we instead jump on every conflict that arises, we'd be stuck in regional conflicts in 3rd-world countries forever.
  - sinyug 5y ago
    > Saudis > Israelis Already ongoing. We know which sides everyone has picked. > Indians We have been targeted by Pakistan-based terrorists for forty years and tens of thousands of people have been murdered. No one bothered to do anything. Instead, Pakistan was promoted to a strategic ally after 9/11 because white people died. We have fought two wars with China. It is a mortal enemy, nuclear power and occupies Indian territory. But when we conducted nuclear tests in 1998 to develop a deterrence, sanctions were imposed on us. When China killed 20 of our soldiers in 2020 - they were bludgeoned to death with barbwire-wrapped clubs - the advice from the world was to peacefully resolve the problem.
    - nojokes 5y ago
      - sinyug 5y ago
        vanusa 5y ago
        sinyug 5y ago
- user-the-name 5y ago
  - fartboi 5y ago
  - dang 5y ago
    We've banned this account for repeatedly and egregiously breaking the site guidelines, and ignoring our multiple requests to stop. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - user-the-name 5y ago
- dirtyid 5y ago
  West has demonstrated the ability to coalesce massive, unprecedented, response to illegal wars was always possible, but they simply do not care enough about non-white people. Even now, shaming, condemning and pressuring neutral countries for importing wheat or gas to feed and heat their own. Seems like even non-white diaspora in the west are seeing past the charade.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
frabbit 5y ago
According to this¹ Polish and Ukranian authorities are treating refugees that look like they are African appallingly. 1. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/28/nigeria-condemns-treatment-africans-trying-to-flee-ukraine-government-poland-discrimination https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/28/nigeria-condem...
- marius_k 5y ago
  I believe it can be true. And it could be not a coincidence that the area near Poland/Ukraine boarder is marked as LGBT-free[0]. I think the situation should be better in the capital Warsaw or Vilnius(Lithuania). I feel shame for those racists. On the other hand it can be popular kind of propaganda: "And you are lynching black people"[1]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT-free_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT-free_zone [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes
  - frabbit 5y ago
    You need to be careful with calling things that are awkward "propaganda". Truth or falsity really should be the only criterion you apply, because some true things are inconvenient. As in this case, where this very calm account details what sounds like organized, wide-spread racism shown by Ukranian authorities: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXBPKoqnsX0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXBPKoqnsX0 I suppose I should not be surprised when there are neo-Nazis actually integrated in the Ukranian army: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right-fighters-ukraine-neo-nazis https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right...
    - marius_k 5y ago
      As I said - I believe it can be true. Eatern Europe still has soviet wounds.
nojokes 5y ago
Putin has stated that the attack against Ukraine was necessary because they are not human (this is what calling somebody a Nazi means in Russia) and they must be destroyed therefore. The second reason was that Ukraine looks too well on sexual minorities and this perversion must be stopped.
pastrybanking 5y ago
As a black African, I still have sympathy for the people of Ukraine. Even on this forum, I have been accused of "stupid whining" when commenting on the plight of brown, foreign students who happen to be caught in this war. Putin may be a lunatic, but the western world should check on itself.
- ashwagary 5y ago
  The western world has been racist and proud of it for centuries, only recently are many seeing the problem with this world view. Even with the blatant racism and double standards from news channels and European countries over the past few months, many still act like they are unaware of the root cause and dance around the issue.
- nojokes 5y ago
kuldeepfouzdar 5y ago
I find it surprising that some people are still not ready accept that these are racist remarks. A similar post here on HN yesterday which was flagged - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30524770 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30524770

> In Austria, Chancellor Karl Nehammer stated that “of course we will take in refugees, if necessary”. Meanwhile, just last fall and in his then-role as interior minister, Nehammer was known as a hardliner against resettling Afghan refugees in Austria and as a politician who insisted on Austria’s right to forcibly deport rejected Afghan asylum seekers, even if that meant returning them to the Taliban. “It’s different in Ukraine than in countries like Afghanistan,” he told Austrian TV. “We’re talking about neighborhood help.” But he wants the entire world to get involved in this "neighborhood war." Black and brown countries should take note of this conflict very seriously. Western imperialism never died. The West is perfectly okay with black on black and brown on brown violence. It is only in the case of black/brown on white or white on white violence that they interfere with such ferocity.

rasz 5y ago
Its about the contrast of men in track suits throwing rocks and climbing fences versus women with children.
- sinyug 5y ago
  > Its about the contrast of men in track suits throwing rocks and climbing fences versus women with children. He is openly talking about neighborhood help. All the media reports are full of "they look like us," "blue eyes" and "blond hair." I am not passing moral judgment on his choices; cultural incompatibility will eventually lead to conflict. I am simply pointing out the hypocrisy of demanding that the whole world join the "isolate Russia" project while simultaneously claiming that it is a neighborhood affair.
  - nojokes 5y ago
    Perhaps you do not realize this but when you live in homogeneous community, differences on other dimension amplify. Saying that they look like us might simply mean that people should put other prejudices aside.
vanusa 5y ago
- ashwagary 5y ago
  >This isn't "white on white violence", and it is racist to cast it in such terms. This is how conflicts are framed when black people are involved in the US. "white on white crime" sounds like a fair description even if it's a somewhat vague term.
jimbob45 5y ago
An alternative take would be that the West is more okay with 3rd-world country violence rather than 1st-world country violence (like Ukraine). It happens to be the case that all countries that have recently seen conflict without significant US intervention were both brown and 3rd-world. I would assume that if the Saudis, Indians, Israelis, or others were to see this same type of conflict, you'd see a much greater US commitment. If we instead jump on every conflict that arises, we'd be stuck in regional conflicts in 3rd-world countries forever.
- sinyug 5y ago
  > Saudis > Israelis Already ongoing. We know which sides everyone has picked. > Indians We have been targeted by Pakistan-based terrorists for forty years and tens of thousands of people have been murdered. No one bothered to do anything. Instead, Pakistan was promoted to a strategic ally after 9/11 because white people died. We have fought two wars with China. It is a mortal enemy, nuclear power and occupies Indian territory. But when we conducted nuclear tests in 1998 to develop a deterrence, sanctions were imposed on us. When China killed 20 of our soldiers in 2020 - they were bludgeoned to death with barbwire-wrapped clubs - the advice from the world was to peacefully resolve the problem.
  - nojokes 5y ago
    - sinyug 5y ago
      - vanusa 5y ago
        sinyug 5y ago
user-the-name 5y ago
- fartboi 5y ago
- dang 5y ago
  We've banned this account for repeatedly and egregiously breaking the site guidelines, and ignoring our multiple requests to stop. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - user-the-name 5y ago
dirtyid 5y ago
West has demonstrated the ability to coalesce massive, unprecedented, response to illegal wars was always possible, but they simply do not care enough about non-white people. Even now, shaming, condemning and pressuring neutral countries for importing wheat or gas to feed and heat their own. Seems like even non-white diaspora in the west are seeing past the charade.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

frabbit 5y ago

According to this¹ Polish and Ukranian authorities are treating refugees that look like they are African appallingly. 1. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/28/nigeria-condemns-treatment-africans-trying-to-flee-ukraine-government-poland-discrimination https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/feb/28/nigeria-condem...

marius_k 5y ago
I believe it can be true. And it could be not a coincidence that the area near Poland/Ukraine boarder is marked as LGBT-free[0]. I think the situation should be better in the capital Warsaw or Vilnius(Lithuania). I feel shame for those racists. On the other hand it can be popular kind of propaganda: "And you are lynching black people"[1]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT-free_zone https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT-free_zone [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes
- frabbit 5y ago
  You need to be careful with calling things that are awkward "propaganda". Truth or falsity really should be the only criterion you apply, because some true things are inconvenient. As in this case, where this very calm account details what sounds like organized, wide-spread racism shown by Ukranian authorities: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXBPKoqnsX0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXBPKoqnsX0 I suppose I should not be surprised when there are neo-Nazis actually integrated in the Ukranian army: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right-fighters-ukraine-neo-nazis https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right...
  - marius_k 5y ago
    As I said - I believe it can be true. Eatern Europe still has soviet wounds.

nojokes 5y ago

Putin has stated that the attack against Ukraine was necessary because they are not human (this is what calling somebody a Nazi means in Russia) and they must be destroyed therefore. The second reason was that Ukraine looks too well on sexual minorities and this perversion must be stopped.

pastrybanking 5y ago

As a black African, I still have sympathy for the people of Ukraine. Even on this forum, I have been accused of "stupid whining" when commenting on the plight of brown, foreign students who happen to be caught in this war. Putin may be a lunatic, but the western world should check on itself.

ashwagary 5y ago
The western world has been racist and proud of it for centuries, only recently are many seeing the problem with this world view. Even with the blatant racism and double standards from news channels and European countries over the past few months, many still act like they are unaware of the root cause and dance around the issue.
nojokes 5y ago

kuldeepfouzdar 5y ago

I find it surprising that some people are still not ready accept that these are racist remarks. A similar post here on HN yesterday which was flagged - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30524770 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30524770