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I’m not a fan of Handshake. The auction system is pretty much the worst system you could build for normal (ie: not rich) businesses that want to register their

I’m not a fan of Handshake. The auction system is pretty much the worst system you could build for normal (ie: not rich) businesses that want to register their own names. Seriously, who wants to compete against people who have a gazillion HNS that they got for free? Then add in the fact that it’s a judgement proof blockchain and you’ve got a system that’s awesome for squatters, flippers, and rent seekers while being terrible for real businesses that want to build real value. How do I stop someone from typo squatting or violating my trademarks? I’m always surprised by the number of people that want lawlessness.

k__ 5y ago
Yes. Saw that on Solana and it sucks hard. I know a bunch of people who lost their auctions to some grifters.
rvz 5y ago
Interesting. However: > Seriously, who wants to compete against people who have a gazillion HNS that they got for free? Or you can buy it off of them, just like you do anywhere else if you were too late to buy say, pets.com, nba.eth or .ftx/ which were all 'squatted and flipped' today. No different here and neither system aimed to totally prevent squatters, flippers and rent seekers. Because you cannot and you know that. > Then add in the fact that it’s a judgement proof blockchain and you’ve got a system that’s awesome for squatters, flippers, and rent seekers while being terrible for real businesses that want to build real value. Are you going to say all of that to the Russian users on Namecheap who are getting their domains de-platformed? [0] Perhaps we loved .org getting into the hands of a private-equity firm didn't we? [1] or even the .io [2] and other TLDs price increases. [3]. All thanks to ICANN, right? At least to some extent with either ENS or Handshake a registrar can't 'de-platform' the whole TLD nor can it be seized by anyone; nor can a government request to de-root an entire TLD. [4] > How do I stop someone from typo squatting or violating my trademarks? As I said before, nobody can stop that and anyone who has a popular online business knows that. Even when you take them down, more typo squatters take its place. It happens everywhere. There will always be typo squatters even after trademark violations, unless you buy the domains off of them. > I’m always surprised by the number of people that want lawlessness. Lawlessness? I wonder how those 'criminals' can really cover their tracks by owning several domains on a public blockchain. /s If you want true lawlessness, use Tor and scrambled .onion links followed by messaging apps like Signal with E2EE and sending private untraceable cryptocurrencies on encrypted blockchains like MobileCoin. It's what all the extremists and criminals use to fund their activities and lawlessness without a trace and no transparency. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30504812 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30504812 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21611677 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21611677 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29403773 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29403773 [3] https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2021/04/ethos-capital-grabbing-power-over-domain-names-again-risking-censorship-profit https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2021/04/ethos-capital-grabbing... [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30509567 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30509567
- dmitriid 5y ago
  > Or you can buy it off of them, just like you do anywhere else Domain squatting is a thing, is a problem, and it surprises me not at all that web3/crypto shills pretend it isn't.
  - thebean11 5y ago
    There's a difference between pretending it doesn't exist, and acknowledging that it's inevitable (especially in a system where there's nobody who can unilaterally reassign other parties' domain names). What would your solution here be?
    - dmitriid 5y ago
      > There's a difference between pretending it doesn't exist No one is pretending it doesn't exist > and acknowledging that it's inevitable What you and the sibling comment are proposing is bot acknowledging it, but making it the normal, and possibly only way to do it, and to incentivize people to do it.
      - thebean11 5y ago
        It is already the norm with the current domain registration system, so I'm not sure what your point is. I recently tried to purchase a domain with some version of my name. There is nothing hosted there (domain name lookup fails). I offered them a few grand for it which I thought was reasonable, no response. Would be interested in your solution to this problem if you have one (seriously, I don't know how to solve it).
        dmitriid 5y ago
        I don't know what the solution is. But a "pay-to-win" scheme on an irreversible ledger isn't it.
        thebean11 5y ago
withinboredom 5y ago
I’ve lost auctions I’ve started by forgetting about it. I usually just hop on name base and send them an offer for the amount they bought it for. Usually they will sell it or be a dick and counter-offer a ridiculous sum. I haven’t had any issue with it.
zozbot234 5y ago
Zooko's triangle implies that human-meaningful names will always be contended (to a varying extent) in a decentralized system. But you don't need human-meaningful names to host your services under, only to optionally direct users to them. So an auction system seems like it should be the most appropriate for such user-facing links. Individual users can always opt for some alternative means of indexing, e.g. "petnames" chosen locally or provided by some source that they trust.
- mprime1 5y ago
  > Zooko’s Triangle https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko's_triangle https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko's_triangle

k__ 5y ago

Yes. Saw that on Solana and it sucks hard. I know a bunch of people who lost their auctions to some grifters.

rvz 5y ago

Interesting. However: > Seriously, who wants to compete against people who have a gazillion HNS that they got for free? Or you can buy it off of them, just like you do anywhere else if you were too late to buy say, pets.com, nba.eth or .ftx/ which were all 'squatted and flipped' today. No different here and neither system aimed to totally prevent squatters, flippers and rent seekers. Because you cannot and you know that. > Then add in the fact that it’s a judgement proof blockchain and you’ve got a system that’s awesome for squatters, flippers, and rent seekers while being terrible for real businesses that want to build real value. Are you going to say all of that to the Russian users on Namecheap who are getting their domains de-platformed? [0] Perhaps we loved .org getting into the hands of a private-equity firm didn't we? [1] or even the .io [2] and other TLDs price increases. [3]. All thanks to ICANN, right? At least to some extent with either ENS or Handshake a registrar can't 'de-platform' the whole TLD nor can it be seized by anyone; nor can a government request to de-root an entire TLD. [4] > How do I stop someone from typo squatting or violating my trademarks? As I said before, nobody can stop that and anyone who has a popular online business knows that. Even when you take them down, more typo squatters take its place. It happens everywhere. There will always be typo squatters even after trademark violations, unless you buy the domains off of them. > I’m always surprised by the number of people that want lawlessness. Lawlessness? I wonder how those 'criminals' can really cover their tracks by owning several domains on a public blockchain. /s If you want true lawlessness, use Tor and scrambled .onion links followed by messaging apps like Signal with E2EE and sending private untraceable cryptocurrencies on encrypted blockchains like MobileCoin. It's what all the extremists and criminals use to fund their activities and lawlessness without a trace and no transparency. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30504812 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30504812 [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21611677 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21611677 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29403773 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29403773 [3] https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2021/04/ethos-capital-grabbing-power-over-domain-names-again-risking-censorship-profit https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2021/04/ethos-capital-grabbing... [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30509567 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30509567

dmitriid 5y ago
> Or you can buy it off of them, just like you do anywhere else Domain squatting is a thing, is a problem, and it surprises me not at all that web3/crypto shills pretend it isn't.
- thebean11 5y ago
  There's a difference between pretending it doesn't exist, and acknowledging that it's inevitable (especially in a system where there's nobody who can unilaterally reassign other parties' domain names). What would your solution here be?
  - dmitriid 5y ago
    > There's a difference between pretending it doesn't exist No one is pretending it doesn't exist > and acknowledging that it's inevitable What you and the sibling comment are proposing is bot acknowledging it, but making it the normal, and possibly only way to do it, and to incentivize people to do it.
    - thebean11 5y ago
      It is already the norm with the current domain registration system, so I'm not sure what your point is. I recently tried to purchase a domain with some version of my name. There is nothing hosted there (domain name lookup fails). I offered them a few grand for it which I thought was reasonable, no response. Would be interested in your solution to this problem if you have one (seriously, I don't know how to solve it).
      - dmitriid 5y ago
        I don't know what the solution is. But a "pay-to-win" scheme on an irreversible ledger isn't it.
        thebean11 5y ago

withinboredom 5y ago

I’ve lost auctions I’ve started by forgetting about it. I usually just hop on name base and send them an offer for the amount they bought it for. Usually they will sell it or be a dick and counter-offer a ridiculous sum. I haven’t had any issue with it.

zozbot234 5y ago

Zooko's triangle implies that human-meaningful names will always be contended (to a varying extent) in a decentralized system. But you don't need human-meaningful names to host your services under, only to optionally direct users to them. So an auction system seems like it should be the most appropriate for such user-facing links. Individual users can always opt for some alternative means of indexing, e.g. "petnames" chosen locally or provided by some source that they trust.

mprime1 5y ago
> Zooko’s Triangle https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko's_triangle https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko's_triangle