3 ms·

This discrimination is not to protect Black or Hispanic students from being outcompeted by Asians, it is there to protect Whites, just like anti-Jewish discrimi

by fmajid 5y ago

This discrimination is not to protect Black or Hispanic students from being outcompeted by Asians, it is there to protect Whites, just like anti-Jewish discrimination before WW2 when Jews were not considered white. Bringing Blacks and Hispanics into the conversation is a red herring used by elite universities to defend the indefensible. If you want to see what a truly meritocratic admissions policy would look like, at least in STEM, just see Caltech, where Asians make up 44% of the student body, not the paltry 15% quota the Ivies have consented to grant them. https://www.registrar.caltech.edu/records/enrollment-statistics https://www.registrar.caltech.edu/records/enrollment-statist... The other thing to consider is that “diversity” somehow fails to consider class. Have you noticed how universities prattle on about racial statistics but getting stats on socio-economic background is like pulling teeth, if you can get data at all?

bzbarsky 5y ago
> it is there to protect Whites Is it? The estimate at https://cdn.substack.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F300c84b0-4407-4a7c-aa90-53a88c81b183_1220x784.png https://cdn.substack.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_p... disagrees, but if you have other data I would be interested. > at least in STEM This is an important caveat, by the way. The racial breakdown differs quite a bit by major at many of these schools. I doubt Harvard would be 44% Asian even without the discrimination they engage in (and so do the authors of the study linked above, who put it at 37% Asian admittees if all the racial/atheletic/legacy preferences went away). > not the paltry 15% quota the Ivies have consented to grant them. 15% when? The data I've seen has Harvard at 15% Asian about 10 years ago. Per the chart above the fraction of Asians in the set of people who get _admitted_ is 24%. Per the numbers at https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/harvard-university/student-life/diversity/ https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/harvard-university/s... Harvard's _enrolled_ undergrads are 21% Asian. Not sure whether the discrepancy has tso do with systematic differences in how often people accept the offer of admission or whether something else is going on. > The other thing to consider is that “diversity” somehow fails to consider class. Yes, fully agreed.
twic 5y ago
I think universities are judged to some extent on class. There are statistics about how many Pell grant recipients they admit, i believe. But one consequence of that is that if you are just slightly too well-off to get a Pell grant, you have no chance, because admitting you won't boost the university's score.
pewpew2020 5y ago
Exactly, if it becomes truly meritocratic, I feel that there are enough qualified Asian (chinese/indian/other countries) applicants that 100% of the batch would be asian.
- cuteboy19 5y ago
  And there is nothing wrong with that, if that ever happened

by fmajid 5y ago

bzbarsky 5y ago

> it is there to protect Whites Is it? The estimate at https://cdn.substack.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_progressive:steep/https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F300c84b0-4407-4a7c-aa90-53a88c81b183_1220x784.png https://cdn.substack.com/image/fetch/f_auto,q_auto:good,fl_p... disagrees, but if you have other data I would be interested. > at least in STEM This is an important caveat, by the way. The racial breakdown differs quite a bit by major at many of these schools. I doubt Harvard would be 44% Asian even without the discrimination they engage in (and so do the authors of the study linked above, who put it at 37% Asian admittees if all the racial/atheletic/legacy preferences went away). > not the paltry 15% quota the Ivies have consented to grant them. 15% when? The data I've seen has Harvard at 15% Asian about 10 years ago. Per the chart above the fraction of Asians in the set of people who get _admitted_ is 24%. Per the numbers at https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/harvard-university/student-life/diversity/ https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/harvard-university/s... Harvard's _enrolled_ undergrads are 21% Asian. Not sure whether the discrepancy has tso do with systematic differences in how often people accept the offer of admission or whether something else is going on. > The other thing to consider is that “diversity” somehow fails to consider class. Yes, fully agreed.

twic 5y ago

I think universities are judged to some extent on class. There are statistics about how many Pell grant recipients they admit, i believe. But one consequence of that is that if you are just slightly too well-off to get a Pell grant, you have no chance, because admitting you won't boost the university's score.

pewpew2020 5y ago

Exactly, if it becomes truly meritocratic, I feel that there are enough qualified Asian (chinese/indian/other countries) applicants that 100% of the batch would be asian.

cuteboy19 5y ago
And there is nothing wrong with that, if that ever happened