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Not that much compared to the rising totalitarianism in e.g. Canada I'd say. Neither Poland nor Hungary are exactly totalitarian, they just happen to reject the

by Ourgon 5y ago

Not that much compared to the rising totalitarianism in e.g. Canada I'd say. Neither Poland nor Hungary are exactly totalitarian, they just happen to reject the demands of a vocal minority who do not agree with their rejection of globalism in favour of a form of nationalism. Political discourse being what it is these days any such rejection, let alone any support of nationalism is directly seen as proof of totalitarianism and all those -isms and -phobias. Given that both countries seem to be functional democracies with at least as reliable an electoral system as, say, the United States of America [1] and given their recent history of occupation by totalitarian regimes I think they're doing quite well in treading their path through the intricacies of European politics. Now Trudeau in Canada, he is someone to look out for. He seems to have collected a clique of cronies around him who are al to willing to suspend civil rights when he feels his position is threatened. I all but assume the next election cycle will rinse the country clean of his ilk and restore confidence in the health of the Canadian state. [1] ...where neither party seems to accept the outcome of the elections, whether those be national (Clinton disputes 2016, Trump disputes 2020) or state (Stacey Abrams still insists on being the true governor of Georgia)

Nursie 5y ago
> rising totalitarianism in e.g. Canada Wow. This is beyond ridiculous. The trucker convoy interrupted international borders and ground a major city to a halt. Emergency powers were used for a limited time to clear it. They have since been rescinded. It is my understanding that such powers specifically to do not contravene Canadian civil rights, and the act used was constructed such that Parliament maintains power and must periodically renew them, not the individual PM. The idea this counts as some sort of totalitarian escalation is bizarre and heavily partisan. The idea that the democrats contested the election in 2016 in a similar way to Trump's "big steal" narrative and actions is also nakedly fantastic.
- Ourgon 5y ago
  The truckers caused disturbances for two weeks while Trudeau's lockdown measures caused disturbances for two years. Living in a country - Sweden - which followed a different path for a similar outcome in SARS2-related I can wholeheartedly say I would take the trucker's disturbance over Trudeau's any day. Also, blocking bank accounts of people who donated to those truckers which was not in violation of any law whatsoever? Welcome to the new world. What little trust those people had in societal institutions will have been erased now.
  - Nursie 5y ago
    > Sweden - which followed a different path for a similar outcome Sweden which has around 1.7x the deaths per million as Canada? Canada is not unique in its approach, many countries followed that path. In fact Sweden is definitely the outlier there. Singling out Canada for criticism is disingenuous. > I would take the trucker's disturbance over Trudeau's any day. So? I'd also take two weeks of crap over two years of pandemic. Guess what? We didn't get a choice about there being a pandemic and your comparison is more or less meaningless. > Also, blocking bank accounts of people who donated to those truckers Didn't actually happen. Go have a read about it. One MP said that one constituent called Brianne had complained that they had their account locked, but refused to give further details. The list of donors was leaked by hackers, nobody by the name given by the MP had donated in the area he represented. You speak like everyone who donated had their accounts frozen, but there's no real evidence it happened to even a single individual. > What little trust those people had in societal institutions will have been erased now. Those people that don't exist? You have fallen for right-wing screeching and propaganda, again.
    - Ourgon 5y ago
      > Sweden which has around 1.7x the deaths per million as Canada? Also, Sweden which will have far fewer deaths and other damages due to 'collateral damage' from lockdowns. With regard to your claim of bank accounts not having been frozen, that goes against most of the "evidence" I've seen as well as against what the deputy prime minister said [1], as well as against Trudeau's claims. I would think twice before siding with the Trudeau regime, they will not go down in history as an example of Canada's vibrant democratic tradition. [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60383385 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60383385
      - Nursie 5y ago
        > Also, Sweden which will have Just you wait! I'll be right in the end! You'll see! LOL. Regardless, as I said, using the example of Sweden (an outlier in policy) to point to Canada as being specifically bad, is fallacious. Maybe Sweden will have a better set of outcomes. That doesn't mean Canada is uniquely bad. Their lockdowns and related covid measures have comparatively middle of the road in global terms. And yes, they froze the accounts of some of the protestors engaged in illegal activities. They did not, as you claimed, freeze donor accounts. The article you linked to doesn't make that claim either, and simply says they would be able to freeze accounts linked to the protest, it doesn't give any more details than that about what actually happened. Given that all your claims have been so hilariously wrong and obviously biased, I don't think I give a **** what you think about the Trudeau 'regime'. The reality is more or less bound to be the exact opposite. You might want to change your media diet a little - right now it's heavy on the right wing talking points and not so good on objectivity.
rootusrootus 5y ago
> Clinton disputes 2016, Trump disputes 2020 Clinton conceded the night of the election. Trump still hasn't.

by Ourgon 5y ago

Nursie 5y ago

> rising totalitarianism in e.g. Canada Wow. This is beyond ridiculous. The trucker convoy interrupted international borders and ground a major city to a halt. Emergency powers were used for a limited time to clear it. They have since been rescinded. It is my understanding that such powers specifically to do not contravene Canadian civil rights, and the act used was constructed such that Parliament maintains power and must periodically renew them, not the individual PM. The idea this counts as some sort of totalitarian escalation is bizarre and heavily partisan. The idea that the democrats contested the election in 2016 in a similar way to Trump's "big steal" narrative and actions is also nakedly fantastic.

Ourgon 5y ago
The truckers caused disturbances for two weeks while Trudeau's lockdown measures caused disturbances for two years. Living in a country - Sweden - which followed a different path for a similar outcome in SARS2-related I can wholeheartedly say I would take the trucker's disturbance over Trudeau's any day. Also, blocking bank accounts of people who donated to those truckers which was not in violation of any law whatsoever? Welcome to the new world. What little trust those people had in societal institutions will have been erased now.
- Nursie 5y ago
  > Sweden - which followed a different path for a similar outcome Sweden which has around 1.7x the deaths per million as Canada? Canada is not unique in its approach, many countries followed that path. In fact Sweden is definitely the outlier there. Singling out Canada for criticism is disingenuous. > I would take the trucker's disturbance over Trudeau's any day. So? I'd also take two weeks of crap over two years of pandemic. Guess what? We didn't get a choice about there being a pandemic and your comparison is more or less meaningless. > Also, blocking bank accounts of people who donated to those truckers Didn't actually happen. Go have a read about it. One MP said that one constituent called Brianne had complained that they had their account locked, but refused to give further details. The list of donors was leaked by hackers, nobody by the name given by the MP had donated in the area he represented. You speak like everyone who donated had their accounts frozen, but there's no real evidence it happened to even a single individual. > What little trust those people had in societal institutions will have been erased now. Those people that don't exist? You have fallen for right-wing screeching and propaganda, again.
  - Ourgon 5y ago
    > Sweden which has around 1.7x the deaths per million as Canada? Also, Sweden which will have far fewer deaths and other damages due to 'collateral damage' from lockdowns. With regard to your claim of bank accounts not having been frozen, that goes against most of the "evidence" I've seen as well as against what the deputy prime minister said [1], as well as against Trudeau's claims. I would think twice before siding with the Trudeau regime, they will not go down in history as an example of Canada's vibrant democratic tradition. [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60383385 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60383385
    - Nursie 5y ago
      > Also, Sweden which will have Just you wait! I'll be right in the end! You'll see! LOL. Regardless, as I said, using the example of Sweden (an outlier in policy) to point to Canada as being specifically bad, is fallacious. Maybe Sweden will have a better set of outcomes. That doesn't mean Canada is uniquely bad. Their lockdowns and related covid measures have comparatively middle of the road in global terms. And yes, they froze the accounts of some of the protestors engaged in illegal activities. They did not, as you claimed, freeze donor accounts. The article you linked to doesn't make that claim either, and simply says they would be able to freeze accounts linked to the protest, it doesn't give any more details than that about what actually happened. Given that all your claims have been so hilariously wrong and obviously biased, I don't think I give a **** what you think about the Trudeau 'regime'. The reality is more or less bound to be the exact opposite. You might want to change your media diet a little - right now it's heavy on the right wing talking points and not so good on objectivity.

rootusrootus 5y ago

> Clinton disputes 2016, Trump disputes 2020 Clinton conceded the night of the election. Trump still hasn't.