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Either you care or not, your government represents the russian people for all the world. I know that individual people should not be blamed, and I'm really sorr

Either you care or not, your government represents the russian people for all the world. I know that individual people should not be blamed, and I'm really sorry that you guys are in the middle of this shit, but the rest of the world has no other effective way of showing to the russian government our disagreement with what they’re doing.

exizt88 5y ago
Thinking that "your government represent your people for all the world" is a really privileged point of view.
- jventura 5y ago
  Political representation of a country. Should have been more explicit..
concinds 5y ago
> your government represents the russian people That's the exact sentiment (along with the "please don't play the pity card" comment higher up) that's leading average Westerners to assault ethnic-Russian or Russian-speaking people living in the West, who have absolutely zero to do with the Russian government. And it's the same sentiment that lead to the rise in anti-Asian hate & violence in the last few years. When average people become an acceptable target, it's (at least implicitly) dehumanizing. Regardless of whether people like you would endorse that violence (I'm sure you never would), we've seen where this rhetoric leads. There's the same classic motte-and-bailey as with coronavirus ("we're really just calling out the government, not the people"), except in the current Russian case, there's a lot more motte than bailey since citizens are explicitly an accepted target.
- nobody9999 5y ago
  >That's the exact sentiment (along with the "please don't play the pity card" comment higher up) that's leading average Westerners to assault ethnic-Russian or Russian-speaking people living in the West That may be true. I haven't heard about such stuff (and a cursory web search didn't show any reports of violence against Russians in Western countries), but I did see protests by Ukrainians in New York City that were joined by Russians, with both groups calling for Russia to stop this violence and murder. Perhaps I'm too wrapped in my own filter bubble that I don't see it? Can you point to specific incidents where civillan Russian nationals and/or those of Russian descent have been attacked in "Western countries"? That would be really helpful. Thanks!
  - concinds 5y ago
    Yes, I can. That perspective came to me from Russian friends, but it's not hard to find news stories of "actual" incidents. https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/vandals-break-windows-spray-paint-russian-restaurant-in-nw-dc-police/2985059/ https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/vandals-break-windo... https://www.cbs8.com/article/news/nation-world/ukraine/russian-restaurant-receives-threats/509-10693ba7-80b9-42c4-8d8f-423df35e72b8 https://www.cbs8.com/article/news/nation-world/ukraine/russi... I even came across tweets sharing the same experience, while searching for these articles. Here's one: https://twitter.com/ZITTIEBNl/status/1497963179409915910 https://twitter.com/ZITTIEBNl/status/1497963179409915910
    - nobody9999 5y ago
      >Yes, I can. That perspective came to me from Russian friends, but it's not hard to find news stories of "actual" incidents. Those are disturbing stories. It's unfortunate that this has only been reported by local news outlets. Folks who engage in such activities should be found and prosecuted to the full extent of the law. There should be no place for such violence/harassment of anyone. I imagine that the vast majority (>98%) of people in Western countries would agree with that statement. But there are assholes everywhere. They are small in number, but they pretty evenly distributed throughout the population. And we will never get rid of them. But a few incidents, while reprehensible, among nearly 3/4 billion people, is hardly a hemispheric plot against Russians and/or those of Russian extraction. Wouldn't you agree?
- jventura 5y ago
  Parent poster here: it seems I should have been more explicit by saying that your government represents russian people in the political sense. I still say that I’m really sorry for the mess russian government has dragged all russian people, but we (rest of the world, especially ukrainian people) have no other effective means to show our disagreement with the russian government. And as someone else on this thread wrote, a war brings inconveniences to both sides, but at least the ukrainians didn’t ask for it.. If you’re russian, I hope you stay safe!
int_19h 5y ago
Why do you believe that this is an "effective way of showing" anything to the Russian government? Do you seriously believe that they care about their people? OTOH it does work wonderfully as fuel for Russian government agitprop: "see, they really are out to get you, not just us!".

exizt88 5y ago

Thinking that "your government represent your people for all the world" is a really privileged point of view.

jventura 5y ago
Political representation of a country. Should have been more explicit..

concinds 5y ago

> your government represents the russian people That's the exact sentiment (along with the "please don't play the pity card" comment higher up) that's leading average Westerners to assault ethnic-Russian or Russian-speaking people living in the West, who have absolutely zero to do with the Russian government. And it's the same sentiment that lead to the rise in anti-Asian hate & violence in the last few years. When average people become an acceptable target, it's (at least implicitly) dehumanizing. Regardless of whether people like you would endorse that violence (I'm sure you never would), we've seen where this rhetoric leads. There's the same classic motte-and-bailey as with coronavirus ("we're really just calling out the government, not the people"), except in the current Russian case, there's a lot more motte than bailey since citizens are explicitly an accepted target.

nobody9999 5y ago
>That's the exact sentiment (along with the "please don't play the pity card" comment higher up) that's leading average Westerners to assault ethnic-Russian or Russian-speaking people living in the West That may be true. I haven't heard about such stuff (and a cursory web search didn't show any reports of violence against Russians in Western countries), but I did see protests by Ukrainians in New York City that were joined by Russians, with both groups calling for Russia to stop this violence and murder. Perhaps I'm too wrapped in my own filter bubble that I don't see it? Can you point to specific incidents where civillan Russian nationals and/or those of Russian descent have been attacked in "Western countries"? That would be really helpful. Thanks!
- concinds 5y ago
  Yes, I can. That perspective came to me from Russian friends, but it's not hard to find news stories of "actual" incidents. https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/vandals-break-windows-spray-paint-russian-restaurant-in-nw-dc-police/2985059/ https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/vandals-break-windo... https://www.cbs8.com/article/news/nation-world/ukraine/russian-restaurant-receives-threats/509-10693ba7-80b9-42c4-8d8f-423df35e72b8 https://www.cbs8.com/article/news/nation-world/ukraine/russi... I even came across tweets sharing the same experience, while searching for these articles. Here's one: https://twitter.com/ZITTIEBNl/status/1497963179409915910 https://twitter.com/ZITTIEBNl/status/1497963179409915910
  - nobody9999 5y ago
    >Yes, I can. That perspective came to me from Russian friends, but it's not hard to find news stories of "actual" incidents. Those are disturbing stories. It's unfortunate that this has only been reported by local news outlets. Folks who engage in such activities should be found and prosecuted to the full extent of the law. There should be no place for such violence/harassment of anyone. I imagine that the vast majority (>98%) of people in Western countries would agree with that statement. But there are assholes everywhere. They are small in number, but they pretty evenly distributed throughout the population. And we will never get rid of them. But a few incidents, while reprehensible, among nearly 3/4 billion people, is hardly a hemispheric plot against Russians and/or those of Russian extraction. Wouldn't you agree?
jventura 5y ago
Parent poster here: it seems I should have been more explicit by saying that your government represents russian people in the political sense. I still say that I’m really sorry for the mess russian government has dragged all russian people, but we (rest of the world, especially ukrainian people) have no other effective means to show our disagreement with the russian government. And as someone else on this thread wrote, a war brings inconveniences to both sides, but at least the ukrainians didn’t ask for it.. If you’re russian, I hope you stay safe!

int_19h 5y ago

Why do you believe that this is an "effective way of showing" anything to the Russian government? Do you seriously believe that they care about their people? OTOH it does work wonderfully as fuel for Russian government agitprop: "see, they really are out to get you, not just us!".