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Please, show me a war where the elite, political class suffered more than the commoners. I’ll wait. I’m as sad as anyone that OnlyFans “content creators” in Ru

Please, show me a war where the elite, political class suffered more than the commoners. I’ll wait. I’m as sad as anyone that OnlyFans “content creators” in Russia aren’t getting paid ( https://news.yahoo.com/russia-blameless-onlyfans-stars-ve-122647835.html https://news.yahoo.com/russia-blameless-onlyfans-stars-ve-12... ) but democracy is worth more in the long run.

DC-3 5y ago
In WW1 the British upper classes, who made up the officer class, were killed at a substantially higher rate than the largely working class enlisted men.
- gruez 5y ago
  1. what was the army participation rate of the upper class vs the lower class? A cursory search seems to suggest the differential was 17% ("officer class") vs 12% ("largely working class enlisted men"). That's close enough that differences in army participation can drown the two out. 2. also relative to the army participation rate, is the suffering of civilians. If working civilians had to suffer rationing, starvation, and disease, while the nobility just chilled in their country side estates tended to be servants, that could more than make up for 1% (or whatever) of nobility dying in battle.
imglorp 5y ago
Sure, the elite everywhere will rest safely in private, but their very public, pet tyrants often don't always as well. Caligula, Hitler, Saddam, Gaddafi, et al did not retire peacefully.
beachy 5y ago
In Cambodia, just days after the Khmer Rouge took power, they ordered 2 million people living in Phnom Penh and other urban areas to head to the countryside. The idea was based on an extreme version of Maoism and a belief in the superiority of the Khmer people, the predominant ethnic group in Cambodia. Citizens were to be turned into traditional rural peasants, referred to as the "old people" by the Khmer Rouge. Urban workers and intelligentsia elites were viewed as "new people" and easily expendable.
- labster 5y ago
  Good example but I probably should have said “interstate war” because civil war is by its nature very often about class warfare. Also, how a war ends doesn’t count: we were talking about sanctions as a means of inflicting suffering during a war.
walkhour 5y ago
It may not count but roman centurions used to lead from the from and had huge mortality rates [0] [0] https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-average-lifespan-of-a-Roman-Centurion https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-average-lifespan-of-a-Rom...
- stjohnswarts 5y ago
  lead from the from?
  - jacquesm 5y ago
    front
    - labster 5y ago
      Honestly the Roman Republic did come to mind when I wrote it because they fielded largely citizen armies, and were better to conquered peoples than everyone around them. But I don’t know enough history to know for sure, nor what it was like to be a victim of Roman aggression.
stjohnswarts 5y ago
The only time they get their comeuppance is when the peasants come knocking on their doors and want their heads and usually things don't progress that far. Then new bad humans take over and start the cycle anew.
rossjudson 5y ago
I'm gonna go with the Romanovs, which is more than slightly ironic.

DC-3 5y ago

In WW1 the British upper classes, who made up the officer class, were killed at a substantially higher rate than the largely working class enlisted men.

gruez 5y ago
1. what was the army participation rate of the upper class vs the lower class? A cursory search seems to suggest the differential was 17% ("officer class") vs 12% ("largely working class enlisted men"). That's close enough that differences in army participation can drown the two out. 2. also relative to the army participation rate, is the suffering of civilians. If working civilians had to suffer rationing, starvation, and disease, while the nobility just chilled in their country side estates tended to be servants, that could more than make up for 1% (or whatever) of nobility dying in battle.

imglorp 5y ago

Sure, the elite everywhere will rest safely in private, but their very public, pet tyrants often don't always as well. Caligula, Hitler, Saddam, Gaddafi, et al did not retire peacefully.

beachy 5y ago

In Cambodia, just days after the Khmer Rouge took power, they ordered 2 million people living in Phnom Penh and other urban areas to head to the countryside. The idea was based on an extreme version of Maoism and a belief in the superiority of the Khmer people, the predominant ethnic group in Cambodia. Citizens were to be turned into traditional rural peasants, referred to as the "old people" by the Khmer Rouge. Urban workers and intelligentsia elites were viewed as "new people" and easily expendable.

labster 5y ago
Good example but I probably should have said “interstate war” because civil war is by its nature very often about class warfare. Also, how a war ends doesn’t count: we were talking about sanctions as a means of inflicting suffering during a war.

walkhour 5y ago

It may not count but roman centurions used to lead from the from and had huge mortality rates [0] [0] https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-average-lifespan-of-a-Roman-Centurion https://www.quora.com/What-was-the-average-lifespan-of-a-Rom...

stjohnswarts 5y ago
lead from the from?
- jacquesm 5y ago
  front
  - labster 5y ago
    Honestly the Roman Republic did come to mind when I wrote it because they fielded largely citizen armies, and were better to conquered peoples than everyone around them. But I don’t know enough history to know for sure, nor what it was like to be a victim of Roman aggression.

stjohnswarts 5y ago

The only time they get their comeuppance is when the peasants come knocking on their doors and want their heads and usually things don't progress that far. Then new bad humans take over and start the cycle anew.

rossjudson 5y ago

I'm gonna go with the Romanovs, which is more than slightly ironic.