5 ms·
When it comes to something as vastly complicated as global politics, I disagree wholeheartedly.
by fuckcensorship 5y ago
When it comes to something as vastly complicated as global politics, I disagree wholeheartedly.
- mhh__ 5y agoThat argument is what tyrants thrive on. Sometimes you need to decide.
- mohanmcgeek 5y agoCalling the other side evil is what tyrants thrive on.
- mhh__ 5y agoI am absolutely happy to call the Russian government evil, I don't live too far away from Salisbury so it's not exactly a theoretical discussion.
- mohanmcgeek 5y agoI mean, Russians would have definitely called the West and Ukraine as evil in their domestic channels. No? There's no good vs evil in international diplomacy.
- koonsolo 5y agoDo you have the same sentiment for Nazi's?
- mohanmcgeek 5y agoThis isn't a sentiment. The simplistic version of the Nazi's rise to power is that they did so by labelling Jews and other minorities as evil. That reinforces my point. Doesn't it? (And were the British any better? See: Bengal Famine)
- koonsolo 5y agoWhat point? That there is no good or evil side?
- mohanmcgeek 5y ago> Calling the other side evil is what tyrants thrive on
- koonsolo 5y ago> There's no good vs evil in international diplomacy. The whole world thinks that Russia is doing an evil thing, just as the whole world thinks Nazi's did an evil thing. You claimed literally "There's no good vs evil", while there clearly is.
- mohanmcgeek 5y agoThe Nazi's certainly didn't think of themselves as evil. They called the other side evil/Jews evil. Same with Stalin's USSR. > The whole world thinks that Russia is doing an evil thing 100+ countries abstained from voting in the resolution condemning Russian actions. That includes India and China which account for 30% of the world population. So the "world" clearly isn't part of whatever propaganda echo chamber you're in. The world, like me, doesn't care what happens in a distant corner in Eastern Europe. In any case, geopolitics isn't good vs evil: countries just pursue their strategic interests. Realpolitik
- koonsolo 5y ago> 100+ countries abstained from voting So they didn't vote in favor of Russia, did they? Even friendly China didn't vote in favor of Russia. > The world, like me, doesn't care what happens in a distant corner in Eastern Europe. Just because you don't care, doesn't make it right.
- mohanmcgeek 5y ago
- fuckcensorship 5y agoI would argue that stifling debate with black and white thinking is more responsible for allowing tyrants to thrive.
- thinkingemote 5y agoThe grandparent of this sub-thread was talking about "cheering for one side". That is a far far long way from "stifling debate". I agree with your sentiments totally but no debate is being stifled. HN on the whole is supporting the side that the vast vast majority of the world is siding with. There are good reasons to in most people's minds. Supporting one side and allowing others to disagree is compatible with no censorship. We are seeing, however, that Russia is doing what China is doing and enacting stronger censorship. Is that a positive sign or not? I would say that it is a sign of a repressive regime. A discussion is also different from a debate. Its an important difference in how you approach conversations online.
- mohanmcgeek 5y agoAnswering "why are you cheering for one side?" With "cuz the other side is evil" is stifling debate. But this is geopolitics we're talking about: There isn't a good side and an evil side.
- Thorrez 5y agoI'm sure Ukraine has done some bad things. But Russian invading is worse than anything Ukraine did, so most people on HN are mad at Russia. >But this is geopolitics we're talking about: There isn't a good side and an evil side. Are you stating that as an absolute fact? There's never been an evil side in global geopolitics? Is it possible for there to be an evil side in geopolitics in the future?
- bckr 5y agoThere's a yin-yang effect going on, certainly. But, taking this metaphor further, if you look at the taijitu, there is a predominantly yin side and a predominantly yang side. And maybe over time they transform into one another (e.g. political parties trading tactics over hundreds of years). But still, for a given moment in time, it's possible to point to the side that's doing the majority of the evil.
- koonsolo 5y agoLike world war 2. Very complex to decide between the Nazi's, the West, and Stalin.
- vernon99 5y agoHistory is written by the winners
- koonsolo 5y agoStalin wrote a lot of history after his victories. Yet he had to close his borders because everybody wanted to get out. My family in law lived under the Soviets, while they were still "winners". You think they liked that regime? Please don't say stupid 1 liners and expect to sound smart.