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...was placed to serve as a Russian puppet to keep Ukraine out of the influence of the West, which the country overwhelmingly wanted. After being tossed out...

...was placed to serve as a Russian puppet to keep Ukraine out of the influence of the West, which the country overwhelmingly wanted. After being tossed out... Could some trouble have been avoided if Yanukovych had left office via election rather than via coup? How many Ukrainians really considered his negotiation tactics with EU so unbecoming that he should have been summarily removed via "extralegal" means?

CRConrad 5y ago
I refer the gentleman to my (amicus curiae) reply in the matter of Arkell vs Pressdr-- eh, avgcorrect vs mise_en_place: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539581 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539581
- jessaustin 5y ago
  Someone else chooses to reply to a simple question with something other than an answer to that question... one wonders why? Who benefits?
  - CRConrad 5y ago
    It's not "a simple question", it's a simpleton question. Either in the sense that it's posed by a simpleton, or that it's posed by someone who hopes that the recipients are simpletons. Either way, the reason it can't have a simple answer is that it's an invalid question, since it presupposes something which isn't true. (As further explained in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539775 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539775 .) And IMO it's a bit suspicious that so many of the "simple questions" on this subject just happen to be couched in Putlin propaganda terms.
jacquesm 5y ago
He didn't leave via a coup, he was voted out 328 to 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity
- jessaustin 5y ago
  We can click through and read wikipedia just like you did. They held that vote after he had fled the nation due to the violent occupation of many government buildings. In fact they held that vote while the parliament building was so occupied.
  - jacquesm 5y ago
    The order isn't what mattered. What mattered is that he was a Russian stooge that fled rather than that he was prosecuted for selling out the country. I'm not really sure what you are trying to argue here, this is pretty much settled history.
    - jessaustin 5y ago
      "Settled history" is for fools. I'm on the side of Ukrainians who want to live in peace and prosperity rather than suffering violence and privation. For that particular interest, it seems that holding elections could be superior to violently occupying government buildings. This "Revolution of Dignity" smelled even more CIA than January 6 did. Mrs. Robert Kagan was just one of the many spooks who left her bloody fingerprints on this supposedly sovereign nation. You call Yanukovych a stooge literally because he negotiated too firmly with EU. This seems similar to Trump being impeached because he delayed sending the same armaments to Ukraine that Obama had refused to send his entire time in office. (It seems maybe those armaments have not had the advertised effect?) Any molehill can be puffed up to a mountain, when the USA military-industrial complex might thereby grind more human lives into dollars...
      - jacquesm 5y ago
        > I'm on the side of Ukrainians who want to live in peace and prosperity rather than suffering violence and privation. You mean 'under the Russian boot'. They already know what that is like, hence their resistance to a repeat performance. The rest of the alternative reality stuff I'll not respond to, feel free to take that any way you want.

CRConrad 5y ago

I refer the gentleman to my (amicus curiae) reply in the matter of Arkell vs Pressdr-- eh, avgcorrect vs mise_en_place: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539581 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539581

jessaustin 5y ago
Someone else chooses to reply to a simple question with something other than an answer to that question... one wonders why? Who benefits?
- CRConrad 5y ago
  It's not "a simple question", it's a simpleton question. Either in the sense that it's posed by a simpleton, or that it's posed by someone who hopes that the recipients are simpletons. Either way, the reason it can't have a simple answer is that it's an invalid question, since it presupposes something which isn't true. (As further explained in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539775 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30539775 .) And IMO it's a bit suspicious that so many of the "simple questions" on this subject just happen to be couched in Putlin propaganda terms.

jacquesm 5y ago

He didn't leave via a coup, he was voted out 328 to 0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution_of_Dignity

jessaustin 5y ago
We can click through and read wikipedia just like you did. They held that vote after he had fled the nation due to the violent occupation of many government buildings. In fact they held that vote while the parliament building was so occupied.
- jacquesm 5y ago
  The order isn't what mattered. What mattered is that he was a Russian stooge that fled rather than that he was prosecuted for selling out the country. I'm not really sure what you are trying to argue here, this is pretty much settled history.
  - jessaustin 5y ago
    "Settled history" is for fools. I'm on the side of Ukrainians who want to live in peace and prosperity rather than suffering violence and privation. For that particular interest, it seems that holding elections could be superior to violently occupying government buildings. This "Revolution of Dignity" smelled even more CIA than January 6 did. Mrs. Robert Kagan was just one of the many spooks who left her bloody fingerprints on this supposedly sovereign nation. You call Yanukovych a stooge literally because he negotiated too firmly with EU. This seems similar to Trump being impeached because he delayed sending the same armaments to Ukraine that Obama had refused to send his entire time in office. (It seems maybe those armaments have not had the advertised effect?) Any molehill can be puffed up to a mountain, when the USA military-industrial complex might thereby grind more human lives into dollars...
    - jacquesm 5y ago
      > I'm on the side of Ukrainians who want to live in peace and prosperity rather than suffering violence and privation. You mean 'under the Russian boot'. They already know what that is like, hence their resistance to a repeat performance. The rest of the alternative reality stuff I'll not respond to, feel free to take that any way you want.