8 ms·

Would be interesting to hear from any russians in here, because i can't help to think that large majority of russians are complicit to what seems to be a dictat

by jdrc 5y ago

Would be interesting to hear from any russians in here, because i can't help to think that large majority of russians are complicit to what seems to be a dictator going mad as much as the dictators in his neighborhood (aliyev, khomeini, taliban etc)

napmo 5y ago
Or Bennett, Netanyahu, and other Israeli maniacs targeting Palestinian people. Illegal Israeli settlers are for sure complicit to these.
- koliber 5y ago
  You're correct, but are distracting the conversation from the matter at hand.
realcertify 5y ago
You are right about large majority of Russians being complicit, and right when saying "what seems to be a dictator going mad". Because it's not a dictator going mad, in fact Putin has quite clear goals and is quite predictable. He repeatedly was warning the West about the balance of power being skewed in their favor and Russia's interests being neglected since 2007. I'm not going to get into much details, and I feel I will be downvoted no matter how I try to reason Putin's behavior, but there are clear reasons behind it. I think with right political moves Russia could achieve the same goals, however looks like Russian diplomacy is in much worse shape than the army, thus there's this conflict going into hot phase. Western media again as always are portraying Putin as a crazy dictator who just needs more blood, however I hope YCombinator folks being critical thinking and curious enough will dig a bit more into the history of this conflict and try to understand the motives of each side. As usual in this world there's no bad guys vs good guys, there's hundreds shades of grey that are actually interesting to research if you wish to. Similar problem is Taiwan by the way.
- csmpltn 5y ago
  > "You are right about large majority of Russians being complicit" Honest question. How do you know a large majority of Russian citizens are being complicit in supporting these acts of war? This is such a broad, generalizing statement. It's not like they were asked to vote on it?
- jdrc 5y ago
  I 'm watching RT to try to understand the russian propaganda, and it seems even the reporters are caught by surprise by the scale of the invasion. What you said does not justify launching a full scale attack against the entirety of ukraine. It does seem like a madman doing mad things thinking this is the 1930s again. As if occupying ukraine would solve the problem you re mentioning...
  - realcertify 5y ago
    This doesn't look much different from the US attacking Iraq or Yugoslavia. All these attacks have serious reasons behind them (and those reasons are not protecting poor children as mass media would tell you).
    - jdrc 5y ago
      i just dont get this mindset in which people draw up ahistorical parallels to make up excuses for something. You stated that the invasion has something to do with geopolitical danger for russia, and was not in retaliation for what US did in Iraq. Is it nationalism? Sense of isolation? Feeling of being denigrated/humiliated by the west? Just blatant personal cult?
      - realcertify 5y ago
        My point is that in all of those cases there were reasons behind the attacks. You are not calling Bush or Clinton crazy for what they did right? Same for Russians.
        5y ago
Klaster_1 5y ago
Here's some examples (Google translate): What regular people think: https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/ya-ne-chuvstvuyu-nichego-krome-straha-moya-babushka-po-tu-storonu-fronta?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/ya-ne-ch... Widely known people: https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/samoe-strashnoe-utro-v-zhizni?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/samoe-st... Both articles take words from my mouth. In last couple of days I've converted all my savings into foreign currencies and am looking to change the job if my current employer (US based) does not fix the wage to USD or EUR. Since this morning, I have hard time thinking about anything but the war. The whole Ukraine situation and other occupied territories is repulsive, but the actual full-scale war was not what I expected. This should not have happened, period. My heart is wholly with Ukrainians. My mother's family comes from there to, so I'm half-ukranainian. As an RF citizen, I feel ashamed, sorry and helpless, even though regular people never had sufficient amount of political leverage during last two decades or even more. Russians will have to work hard to internalize the putin's rule when (if) he and his cronies go away, same as what people of Germany did after WWII.
- xdennis 5y ago
  I don't think those are regular Russians. They all seem connected to Ukraine. What do Russians who don't have Ukrainian relatives feel?
  - nrvn 5y ago
    That that have been brainwashed or retarded support that. Reasonable people don’t.
tasuki 5y ago
Why do you think Putin is going mad? His actions might be immoral, but I don't think they're illogical. I see Putin as a very competent and ruthless leader. As a citizen of a post communist country, I'm somewhat concerned.
- jdrc 5y ago
  > but I don't think they're illogical. Can you elaborate, in material terms, what does russia win by invading and occupying ukraine? What do you imagine the economy of ukrainian people will be after this?
  - abandonliberty 5y ago
    I want the same answer.
gen220 5y ago
I have the secondhand POV of a middle class Russian friend who grew up in Moscow and went to US for university, and keeps very up to date with domestic politics and economy. Did not expect full-scale invasion, has many generalized and specific concerns about what comes next. Believes that Putin does not care about the opinion of the well-to-do Russian diaspora, even if they have fiscal or monetary connections to Russia. Very concerned, at the personal level, about the impact of broader sanctions that threaten to isolate the Russian economy like the Iranian economy. Views Putin as responsible for provoking these sanctions. However, he believes that the general Russian public is generally supportive of Putin's actions.

by jdrc 5y ago

napmo 5y ago

Or Bennett, Netanyahu, and other Israeli maniacs targeting Palestinian people. Illegal Israeli settlers are for sure complicit to these.

koliber 5y ago
You're correct, but are distracting the conversation from the matter at hand.

realcertify 5y ago

You are right about large majority of Russians being complicit, and right when saying "what seems to be a dictator going mad". Because it's not a dictator going mad, in fact Putin has quite clear goals and is quite predictable. He repeatedly was warning the West about the balance of power being skewed in their favor and Russia's interests being neglected since 2007. I'm not going to get into much details, and I feel I will be downvoted no matter how I try to reason Putin's behavior, but there are clear reasons behind it. I think with right political moves Russia could achieve the same goals, however looks like Russian diplomacy is in much worse shape than the army, thus there's this conflict going into hot phase. Western media again as always are portraying Putin as a crazy dictator who just needs more blood, however I hope YCombinator folks being critical thinking and curious enough will dig a bit more into the history of this conflict and try to understand the motives of each side. As usual in this world there's no bad guys vs good guys, there's hundreds shades of grey that are actually interesting to research if you wish to. Similar problem is Taiwan by the way.

csmpltn 5y ago
> "You are right about large majority of Russians being complicit" Honest question. How do you know a large majority of Russian citizens are being complicit in supporting these acts of war? This is such a broad, generalizing statement. It's not like they were asked to vote on it?
jdrc 5y ago
I 'm watching RT to try to understand the russian propaganda, and it seems even the reporters are caught by surprise by the scale of the invasion. What you said does not justify launching a full scale attack against the entirety of ukraine. It does seem like a madman doing mad things thinking this is the 1930s again. As if occupying ukraine would solve the problem you re mentioning...
- realcertify 5y ago
  This doesn't look much different from the US attacking Iraq or Yugoslavia. All these attacks have serious reasons behind them (and those reasons are not protecting poor children as mass media would tell you).
  - jdrc 5y ago
    i just dont get this mindset in which people draw up ahistorical parallels to make up excuses for something. You stated that the invasion has something to do with geopolitical danger for russia, and was not in retaliation for what US did in Iraq. Is it nationalism? Sense of isolation? Feeling of being denigrated/humiliated by the west? Just blatant personal cult?
    - realcertify 5y ago
      My point is that in all of those cases there were reasons behind the attacks. You are not calling Bush or Clinton crazy for what they did right? Same for Russians.
      - 5y ago

Klaster_1 5y ago

Here's some examples (Google translate): What regular people think: https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/ya-ne-chuvstvuyu-nichego-krome-straha-moya-babushka-po-tu-storonu-fronta?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/ya-ne-ch... Widely known people: https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/samoe-strashnoe-utro-v-zhizni?_x_tr_sl=ru&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp https://meduza-io.translate.goog/feature/2022/02/24/samoe-st... Both articles take words from my mouth. In last couple of days I've converted all my savings into foreign currencies and am looking to change the job if my current employer (US based) does not fix the wage to USD or EUR. Since this morning, I have hard time thinking about anything but the war. The whole Ukraine situation and other occupied territories is repulsive, but the actual full-scale war was not what I expected. This should not have happened, period. My heart is wholly with Ukrainians. My mother's family comes from there to, so I'm half-ukranainian. As an RF citizen, I feel ashamed, sorry and helpless, even though regular people never had sufficient amount of political leverage during last two decades or even more. Russians will have to work hard to internalize the putin's rule when (if) he and his cronies go away, same as what people of Germany did after WWII.

xdennis 5y ago
I don't think those are regular Russians. They all seem connected to Ukraine. What do Russians who don't have Ukrainian relatives feel?
- nrvn 5y ago
  That that have been brainwashed or retarded support that. Reasonable people don’t.

tasuki 5y ago

Why do you think Putin is going mad? His actions might be immoral, but I don't think they're illogical. I see Putin as a very competent and ruthless leader. As a citizen of a post communist country, I'm somewhat concerned.

jdrc 5y ago
> but I don't think they're illogical. Can you elaborate, in material terms, what does russia win by invading and occupying ukraine? What do you imagine the economy of ukrainian people will be after this?
- abandonliberty 5y ago
  I want the same answer.

gen220 5y ago

I have the secondhand POV of a middle class Russian friend who grew up in Moscow and went to US for university, and keeps very up to date with domestic politics and economy. Did not expect full-scale invasion, has many generalized and specific concerns about what comes next. Believes that Putin does not care about the opinion of the well-to-do Russian diaspora, even if they have fiscal or monetary connections to Russia. Very concerned, at the personal level, about the impact of broader sanctions that threaten to isolate the Russian economy like the Iranian economy. Views Putin as responsible for provoking these sanctions. However, he believes that the general Russian public is generally supportive of Putin's actions.