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I found those NSF outreach requirements very frustrating, because I knew (or believed) that aside from some actually conscientious and dedicated people, most ev

I found those NSF outreach requirements very frustrating, because I knew (or believed) that aside from some actually conscientious and dedicated people, most everyone was making up perfunctory or fictitious plans for how they would satisfy this requirement if they got the grant. And the NSF would not be checking on whether people actually did those things, or take back the money if they weren't fulfilled, so basically (I felt at the time) it was incentivizing people to lie about their intentions. I didn't feel good about making up such stories. So I guess I lost out to those who were willing. If you're going to put in requirements like this, I think you'd better follow up and make sure people don't take you for fools and say what you want to hear but not do it later. (edit to add: my experience is based on having been through this 15 years ago, so it's probably to be taken with a grain o salt)

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ModernMech 5y ago
> I knew (or believed) that aside from some actually conscientious and dedicated people, most everyone was making up perfunctory or fictitious plans for how they would satisfy this requirement if they got the grant. > And the NSF would not be checking on whether people actually did those things, or take back the money if they weren't fulfilled, so basically (I felt at the time) it was incentivizing people to lie about their intentions. I didn't feel good about making up such stories. So I guess I lost out to those who were willing. On what are you basing these assertions? As part of an NSF funded research project with an outreach component, we definitely had to deliver on it and I had to write about it in our annual reviews. If we had failed to deliver on our promises in a perfunctory of fictitious way, we definitely would have been in jeopardy of having our funding pulled. The NSF doesn't have to take back money because they don't give you all of the money up front. They can refuse to give you the rest of your funding, and then good luck on your next NSF grant proposal.
- supernova87a 5y ago
  I believe you, about how it is now. It didn't seem that way 15 years ago when I was observing it.

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ModernMech 5y ago

> I knew (or believed) that aside from some actually conscientious and dedicated people, most everyone was making up perfunctory or fictitious plans for how they would satisfy this requirement if they got the grant. > And the NSF would not be checking on whether people actually did those things, or take back the money if they weren't fulfilled, so basically (I felt at the time) it was incentivizing people to lie about their intentions. I didn't feel good about making up such stories. So I guess I lost out to those who were willing. On what are you basing these assertions? As part of an NSF funded research project with an outreach component, we definitely had to deliver on it and I had to write about it in our annual reviews. If we had failed to deliver on our promises in a perfunctory of fictitious way, we definitely would have been in jeopardy of having our funding pulled. The NSF doesn't have to take back money because they don't give you all of the money up front. They can refuse to give you the rest of your funding, and then good luck on your next NSF grant proposal.

supernova87a 5y ago
I believe you, about how it is now. It didn't seem that way 15 years ago when I was observing it.