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The primary reason this behavior is allowed to exist and expected to continue is that software is not a true profession in the formal sense: https://github.com

The primary reason this behavior is allowed to exist and expected to continue is that software is not a true profession in the formal sense: https://github.com/prettydiff/wisdom/blob/master/Leadership_In_Software.md#professionalism https://github.com/prettydiff/wisdom/blob/master/Leadership_...

Bancakes 5y ago
We already have licenses, they're called university degrees. You can get certifications, e.g. Cisco, but those are overpriced. We should be avoiding centralized authority, the profession allows it. We are knowledge workers and it so happens the only qualified people to certify and judge us are other knowledge workers, not bureaucrats. To that end, your CV is the best license you can carry. It's unique per person unlike generalized licenses that lump people together like a hash collision.
- austincheney 5y ago
  Perhaps the most Dunning-Kruger response I can imagine. Education is never a license to practice in any industry, and rarely required for anything in software. Confusing this only devalues education for the developer too ignorant or entitled to understand the difference.
  - Bancakes 5y ago
    Have you tried getting a serious job without a degree? Education is used as a de facto license. One exception is education cannot be revoked, but then again people who write buggy, leaky code don't get fired let alone forbidden from practicing. Requiring licenses will have two effects - making people pay money, and complicating job seeking. You can gauge a bridge for safety. You can test weld jobs. You cannot standardize code writing ability. My understanding is you want the profession to remain the same with the exception of bearing an extra piece of paper to my name. What does this improve? What I'm saying is, you're not original or clever in wanting something the industry and academia does not, and has invested in figuring out.
    - austincheney 5y ago
      I have known many people earn high paying jobs without college. Likewise education won’t make you a medical doctor, a lawyer, engineer, school teacher, or even a truck driver. They each have requirements in addition to education. In no case is education a license to practice in any industry.
      - Bancakes 5y ago
        Again you assume I'm talking about "any industry". I am talking about the software industry, which makes the world run without licenses. I'm glad you know outliers and I'm glad you know about normal distributions.
frankish 5y ago
Honestly, getting marketing and sales to follow these practices would go further than software engineers.

Bancakes 5y ago

We already have licenses, they're called university degrees. You can get certifications, e.g. Cisco, but those are overpriced. We should be avoiding centralized authority, the profession allows it. We are knowledge workers and it so happens the only qualified people to certify and judge us are other knowledge workers, not bureaucrats. To that end, your CV is the best license you can carry. It's unique per person unlike generalized licenses that lump people together like a hash collision.

austincheney 5y ago
Perhaps the most Dunning-Kruger response I can imagine. Education is never a license to practice in any industry, and rarely required for anything in software. Confusing this only devalues education for the developer too ignorant or entitled to understand the difference.
- Bancakes 5y ago
  Have you tried getting a serious job without a degree? Education is used as a de facto license. One exception is education cannot be revoked, but then again people who write buggy, leaky code don't get fired let alone forbidden from practicing. Requiring licenses will have two effects - making people pay money, and complicating job seeking. You can gauge a bridge for safety. You can test weld jobs. You cannot standardize code writing ability. My understanding is you want the profession to remain the same with the exception of bearing an extra piece of paper to my name. What does this improve? What I'm saying is, you're not original or clever in wanting something the industry and academia does not, and has invested in figuring out.
  - austincheney 5y ago
    I have known many people earn high paying jobs without college. Likewise education won’t make you a medical doctor, a lawyer, engineer, school teacher, or even a truck driver. They each have requirements in addition to education. In no case is education a license to practice in any industry.
    - Bancakes 5y ago
      Again you assume I'm talking about "any industry". I am talking about the software industry, which makes the world run without licenses. I'm glad you know outliers and I'm glad you know about normal distributions.

frankish 5y ago

Honestly, getting marketing and sales to follow these practices would go further than software engineers.