3 ms·

Yes, of course you can heat with electricity - and using heat pumps this is definitely the future. However, the amount of nuclear available would make only a sm

by _ph_ 5y ago

Yes, of course you can heat with electricity - and using heat pumps this is definitely the future. However, the amount of nuclear available would make only a small difference here. It should be much easier to just buy gas internationally and push forward with renewables.

cinntaile 5y ago
You can also use the heat directly (district heating) without having to go to electricity and back. This limits the electricity output efficiency but increases the overall efficiency of the plant. It requires changes to the turbines and the buildout of a district heating system though.
- _ph_ 5y ago
  Sure you could heat with nuclear directly. Actually that sounds like something that should have been done when nuclear was in fashion. But you would have to produce a lot of new infrastructure and most of all, new nuclear plants. None of the existing nuclear plants is suitable for that. And that is sure, while keeping the remaining nuclear power plants in service a little bit longer might be a consideration (though unlikely), investing in new nuclear infrastructure for sure isn't. There, renewables are the way to go.
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    Germans can barely get their heads around nuclear energy. Pumping fluids that have been anywhere near a reactor into homes will be untenable.
    - _ph_ 5y ago
      I don't think this is the core problem, that would have been to build a nuclear reactor so close to a major city, that you could run a pipe to it.
      - cinntaile 5y ago
        As you can tell from the map that's not really an issue. Nuclear power plants aren't in the middle of nowhere, they need access to an educated workforce. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/The-map-of-Nuclear-Power-Plants-in-Europe-In-these-and-related-tasks-the-NEA-works-in_fig1_265969813 https://www.researchgate.net/figure/The-map-of-Nuclear-Power...
        _ph_ 5y ago
        They aren't in the middle of nowhere, but usually quite a bit away from city centers, for safety reasons. Too far for a hot water line to be practical.
        cinntaile 5y ago
        Up to 30km is no problem for water between 90-175 degrees celcius, so you reach plenty of cities. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.apenergy.2018.02.080 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.apenergy.2018.02.080
      - LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
        SMRs operating at atmospheric pressure, or otherwise more managable due to smaller scales may alleviate that.
- LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
  https://waerme.hamburg/presse-media/pressemitteilungen/erneuerbare-waerme-fuer-27.000-haushalte https://waerme.hamburg/presse-media/pressemitteilungen/erneu... <- This is one such plant at the western edge of Hamburg, being remodeled for that use-case. Having recently seen workers from Statnett climbing the masts in the rain to put pilot wires to pull new wires(80MW upgrade) on one half of the masts, while hearing the 50hz-buzz about 25 to 30 meters below. Crazy Vikings! :-)

by _ph_ 5y ago

cinntaile 5y ago

You can also use the heat directly (district heating) without having to go to electricity and back. This limits the electricity output efficiency but increases the overall efficiency of the plant. It requires changes to the turbines and the buildout of a district heating system though.

_ph_ 5y ago
Sure you could heat with nuclear directly. Actually that sounds like something that should have been done when nuclear was in fashion. But you would have to produce a lot of new infrastructure and most of all, new nuclear plants. None of the existing nuclear plants is suitable for that. And that is sure, while keeping the remaining nuclear power plants in service a little bit longer might be a consideration (though unlikely), investing in new nuclear infrastructure for sure isn't. There, renewables are the way to go.
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  Germans can barely get their heads around nuclear energy. Pumping fluids that have been anywhere near a reactor into homes will be untenable.
  - _ph_ 5y ago
    I don't think this is the core problem, that would have been to build a nuclear reactor so close to a major city, that you could run a pipe to it.
    - cinntaile 5y ago
      As you can tell from the map that's not really an issue. Nuclear power plants aren't in the middle of nowhere, they need access to an educated workforce. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/The-map-of-Nuclear-Power-Plants-in-Europe-In-these-and-related-tasks-the-NEA-works-in_fig1_265969813 https://www.researchgate.net/figure/The-map-of-Nuclear-Power...
      - _ph_ 5y ago
        They aren't in the middle of nowhere, but usually quite a bit away from city centers, for safety reasons. Too far for a hot water line to be practical.
        cinntaile 5y ago
        Up to 30km is no problem for water between 90-175 degrees celcius, so you reach plenty of cities. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.apenergy.2018.02.080 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.apenergy.2018.02.080
    - LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
      SMRs operating at atmospheric pressure, or otherwise more managable due to smaller scales may alleviate that.
LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
https://waerme.hamburg/presse-media/pressemitteilungen/erneuerbare-waerme-fuer-27.000-haushalte https://waerme.hamburg/presse-media/pressemitteilungen/erneu... <- This is one such plant at the western edge of Hamburg, being remodeled for that use-case. Having recently seen workers from Statnett climbing the masts in the rain to put pilot wires to pull new wires(80MW upgrade) on one half of the masts, while hearing the 50hz-buzz about 25 to 30 meters below. Crazy Vikings! :-)