4 ms·

Absolutely finally. Why should a European take off their pants when traveling to the US, go through rude and racist immigration and Americans can easily enter t

Absolutely finally. Why should a European take off their pants when traveling to the US, go through rude and racist immigration and Americans can easily enter the EU? Never understood that. I want at least the same treatment for them, incl. pre checks, Information requests like social media accounts, pre registrations and a fee.

jokethrowaway 5y ago
If you're against US immigration process, you shouldn't be happy the same is happening to Europe. We're just becoming one big dystopia. When are people going to realise that?
- aahortwwy 5y ago
  Yeah, the whole "this sucks; it should apply to everyone" mindset never made sense to me...
  - plafl 5y ago
    It makes it easier to gather support to change the situation. Good luck if you are in the minority with the problem.
- satellite2 5y ago
  OP didn't state they were happy. But reciprocity might be the basis to develop fair relationship. Otherwise how would Americans realize their behavior is problematic?
  - gregoryl 5y ago
    I mean, Americans haven't realised yet, I doubt that will change.
- ionicgiraffe 5y ago
  If Europeans had some power on the immigration decisions of the US it would be stupid to make it worse for others when you could just accept it to be worse only for yourself. On the other hand, a lot of people that have never experienced something do not even realize that that problem even exists or is real. Maybe experiencing a little bit of difficulty will enrich the vision of those. Still, I think the point should be that with this pre-approvals you have end up with an easier immigration process and less worries for both sides (less time at immigration and not being turned down in the last moment).
Hamuko 5y ago
Does the US border check still want all of your social media accounts and a scan of your phone and laptop contents? I've maintained US on my list of countries that I do not want to visit because they seem to want all of my personal data just to get into the country.
- bogota 5y ago
  Its not guaranteed they will ask but yes they still do sometimes. Its just luck of the border agent draw.
  - xtracto 5y ago
    Luck and not behaving very Hispanic/Arab/Iranian. If you happen to behave like that, suddenly luck gets to be on your side. Source: Hispanic that used to travel a lot the US and always got VERY LUCKY! (I should have bought Powerball in the US, for some reason being in the USA gave me luck.
    - bogota 5y ago
      Yeah I understand that. I was trying to put it nicely as talking about US immigration and border patrol policies make me very sad to be from the US. It’s a complex issue but at the end of the day current policies end with people not being treated like humans. My wife is from another country and the mental tax that going through the US immigration system has had on us took two years to recover from. The entire system is meant to be punitive and humiliating.
- TameAntelope 5y ago
  None of that information was required for entry into the US, that has never been the policy.
  - Hamuko 5y ago
    What about in practice?
TameAntelope 5y ago
Hm, well none of any of that would be additionally required for this new program, and I'd be willing to wager EU law prohibits the collection of social media account information.
- bilbo0s 5y ago
  EU law prohibits the collection of social media account information I looked it up, and by my reading it does prohibit collection of social media account information. However, it's not clear to me that these protections apply to non-EU residents? Any actual lawyers able to chime in on this? I guess at worst, any suspicious US citizens will have their internet details collected? Since we do the same to EU citizens, I guess I can't complain, but this creeping global data collection monster really gets under my skin.
klipt 5y ago
If all countries imposed visa reciprocity, Europeans would lose a lot of their visa free privileges too. The fundamental principle deciding visa restrictions isn't reciprocity, it's power.
- verst 5y ago
  You make it sound as if Americans wouldn't also be losing a lot of visa free privileges around the world. We absolutely would.
  - klipt 5y ago
    If the fundamental principle was reciprocity. Which it isn't.
8note 5y ago
Free movement is beneficial to the place people are arriving?

jokethrowaway 5y ago

If you're against US immigration process, you shouldn't be happy the same is happening to Europe. We're just becoming one big dystopia. When are people going to realise that?

aahortwwy 5y ago
Yeah, the whole "this sucks; it should apply to everyone" mindset never made sense to me...
- plafl 5y ago
  It makes it easier to gather support to change the situation. Good luck if you are in the minority with the problem.
satellite2 5y ago
OP didn't state they were happy. But reciprocity might be the basis to develop fair relationship. Otherwise how would Americans realize their behavior is problematic?
- gregoryl 5y ago
  I mean, Americans haven't realised yet, I doubt that will change.
ionicgiraffe 5y ago
If Europeans had some power on the immigration decisions of the US it would be stupid to make it worse for others when you could just accept it to be worse only for yourself. On the other hand, a lot of people that have never experienced something do not even realize that that problem even exists or is real. Maybe experiencing a little bit of difficulty will enrich the vision of those. Still, I think the point should be that with this pre-approvals you have end up with an easier immigration process and less worries for both sides (less time at immigration and not being turned down in the last moment).

Hamuko 5y ago

Does the US border check still want all of your social media accounts and a scan of your phone and laptop contents? I've maintained US on my list of countries that I do not want to visit because they seem to want all of my personal data just to get into the country.

bogota 5y ago
Its not guaranteed they will ask but yes they still do sometimes. Its just luck of the border agent draw.
- xtracto 5y ago
  Luck and not behaving very Hispanic/Arab/Iranian. If you happen to behave like that, suddenly luck gets to be on your side. Source: Hispanic that used to travel a lot the US and always got VERY LUCKY! (I should have bought Powerball in the US, for some reason being in the USA gave me luck.
  - bogota 5y ago
    Yeah I understand that. I was trying to put it nicely as talking about US immigration and border patrol policies make me very sad to be from the US. It’s a complex issue but at the end of the day current policies end with people not being treated like humans. My wife is from another country and the mental tax that going through the US immigration system has had on us took two years to recover from. The entire system is meant to be punitive and humiliating.
TameAntelope 5y ago
None of that information was required for entry into the US, that has never been the policy.
- Hamuko 5y ago
  What about in practice?

TameAntelope 5y ago

Hm, well none of any of that would be additionally required for this new program, and I'd be willing to wager EU law prohibits the collection of social media account information.

bilbo0s 5y ago
EU law prohibits the collection of social media account information I looked it up, and by my reading it does prohibit collection of social media account information. However, it's not clear to me that these protections apply to non-EU residents? Any actual lawyers able to chime in on this? I guess at worst, any suspicious US citizens will have their internet details collected? Since we do the same to EU citizens, I guess I can't complain, but this creeping global data collection monster really gets under my skin.

klipt 5y ago

If all countries imposed visa reciprocity, Europeans would lose a lot of their visa free privileges too. The fundamental principle deciding visa restrictions isn't reciprocity, it's power.

verst 5y ago
You make it sound as if Americans wouldn't also be losing a lot of visa free privileges around the world. We absolutely would.
- klipt 5y ago
  If the fundamental principle was reciprocity. Which it isn't.

8note 5y ago

Free movement is beneficial to the place people are arriving?