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people don’t generally tend to feel this way about training to work in medicine or hvac or law. or even language, really. obviously children learn how to use la

people don’t generally tend to feel this way about training to work in medicine or hvac or law. or even language, really. obviously children learn how to use language, but training for a professional job as a teacher or a translator (or whatever) doesn’t start at age 8.

strken 5y ago
Kids learn how to read, write, and speak at least one language. Kids who learn two or more presumably turn into better translators. Potential lawyers have access to debate clubs and are trained in public speaking. I know one HVAC technician, and he's been working on cars and bikes with his dad since early childhood. Even doctors get taught biology. I pretty firmly believe nearly anyone can learn to contribute in any area given enough time, but there's a lot of time between 0 and 18, and it's prime learning time when brain plasticity is high and responsibilities are low. Is it really that controversial to say childhood shapes a kid's future?
- Apocryphon 5y ago
  No, the controversial statement in question was the claim that "18 is awfully old to start learning something for the first time" wrt programming.
  - visarga 5y ago
    It's late only if you want to become a top programmer. Top programmers are like top pianists, they start early and are very motivated.
    - dgb23 5y ago
      I started at around 10, but there are plenty of programmers I look up to that didn’t. It’s an indication of intrinsic motivation and genuine interest, but there are plenty of people who find that much later. Even today, 25 years later I feel like I learn things more effectively than when I was a kid. Certain types of skills benefit from experience and networked thought. Time per day/week is a much more limiting factor though.
  - baq 5y ago
    it absolutely isn't in the context. you start to learn maths in kindergarten. you don't start to program computers there, usually. there are very good reasons not to do that (screen time!), but it will make learning to program easier later in life.
    - Apocryphon 5y ago
      Learning to program early makes later programming easier is an uncontroversial, anodyne statement. Saying that 18 is too late to start learning is, because that is discounting everyone who learns at that age or later.
jokethrowaway 5y ago
I'd argue learning programming is a different skill compared to memorising laws or biology, it's math more than anything else (especially logic, set theory). Lawyers and doctors basically need to memorise facts, apply rules and make deductions. Developers need to do that + math, hence why starting early helps you out, exactly like kids who did math or chess early on are better than their peers who started later.

strken 5y ago

Kids learn how to read, write, and speak at least one language. Kids who learn two or more presumably turn into better translators. Potential lawyers have access to debate clubs and are trained in public speaking. I know one HVAC technician, and he's been working on cars and bikes with his dad since early childhood. Even doctors get taught biology. I pretty firmly believe nearly anyone can learn to contribute in any area given enough time, but there's a lot of time between 0 and 18, and it's prime learning time when brain plasticity is high and responsibilities are low. Is it really that controversial to say childhood shapes a kid's future?

Apocryphon 5y ago
No, the controversial statement in question was the claim that "18 is awfully old to start learning something for the first time" wrt programming.
- visarga 5y ago
  It's late only if you want to become a top programmer. Top programmers are like top pianists, they start early and are very motivated.
  - dgb23 5y ago
    I started at around 10, but there are plenty of programmers I look up to that didn’t. It’s an indication of intrinsic motivation and genuine interest, but there are plenty of people who find that much later. Even today, 25 years later I feel like I learn things more effectively than when I was a kid. Certain types of skills benefit from experience and networked thought. Time per day/week is a much more limiting factor though.
- baq 5y ago
  it absolutely isn't in the context. you start to learn maths in kindergarten. you don't start to program computers there, usually. there are very good reasons not to do that (screen time!), but it will make learning to program easier later in life.
  - Apocryphon 5y ago
    Learning to program early makes later programming easier is an uncontroversial, anodyne statement. Saying that 18 is too late to start learning is, because that is discounting everyone who learns at that age or later.

jokethrowaway 5y ago

I'd argue learning programming is a different skill compared to memorising laws or biology, it's math more than anything else (especially logic, set theory). Lawyers and doctors basically need to memorise facts, apply rules and make deductions. Developers need to do that + math, hence why starting early helps you out, exactly like kids who did math or chess early on are better than their peers who started later.