5 ms·

I’m really curious about the fbi bit. Do you have any further reading?

xyzzy_plugh 5y ago
I don't know about the FBI specifically but telecom equipment is regulated and in most places it's not legal to roll your own interface to the infrastructure. Even if you bring your own modem these days, it becomes administered remotely by your ISP. Similar to phreaking being a crime. Even if you have an agreement with your ISP, I'd expect you'd be breaking it and crossing into fraud or toll fraud at the least.
- netr0ute 5y ago
  > telecom equipment is regulated This is tricky, because "telecom" only has POTS and cable TV within its scope. "Internet" service that just uses ethernet technologies are their own separate thing, and why "Ma Bell" megacorps can get away with their junk Internet service because it's regulated differently than POTS.
- mschuster91 5y ago
  > I don't know about the FBI specifically but telecom equipment is regulated and in most places it's not legal to roll your own interface to the infrastructure. In the EU, the Directive 2015/2120 [1] enforces the ability of customers to bring their own modems, no matter if you are running fiber, xDSL or DOCSIS. [1]: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/DE/TXT/?uri=celex%3A32015R2120 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/DE/TXT/?uri=celex%3A...
  - emteycz 5y ago
    Nice, but it's not possible to not pay cable modem rent and/or connect a different modem in practice... (Vodafone CZ)
    - mschuster91 5y ago
      Vodafone has gotten under fire here in Germany for the same shady practice too [1]. They are seriously one of the worst providers out there... but they must allow you to connect your own modem. Get a lawyer or go to your equivalent of a consumer protection agency. [1]: https://www.teltarif.de/zwang-zum-router-trotz-routerfreiheit/news/67749.html?page=all https://www.teltarif.de/zwang-zum-router-trotz-routerfreihei...
    - omnimus 5y ago
      UPC got slapped for this before it was sold to Vodafone. So for a time one could buy the modem - its pretty nasty because the rent price is exactly calculated from 2 years the company has warranty from the hw distributor. So basically if you use it for more than 2 years you are paying for payed off hardware for nothing. And of course those devices and users last far more than 2 years (more like 5-10) this is just money printing. But other coment is right. They have to allow you use your device.
dec0dedab0de 5y ago
When I said that I was thinking of a story from 10 or 20 years ago where a bunch of people were increasing their bandwidth by hacking their cablemodems, and they all got raided. I can't seem to find the exact story right now, but Google returns a few similar stories.
- LinuxBender 5y ago
  I vaguely remember this. IIRC the people raided were those hacking into the CMTS to uncap their modems and their friends modems and I want to say that at least one of them was selling services to uncap modems. Perhaps the notion of hacking was just modding the cable modem to ignore limits being given by the CMTS but either way I believe someone was selling access to this which got the attention of the feds.
  - Nextgrid 5y ago
    That seems like an awfully terrible design if the user-controlled equipment is responsible for rate-limiting instead of the CMTS itself.
    - LinuxBender 5y ago
      I agree. No idea if that is still possible these days. Perhaps someone here is involved in the DOCSIS standards or is a cable modem hacker and could offer some insight as to how things may have evolved.

I don't know about the FBI specifically but telecom equipment is regulated and in most places it's not legal to roll your own interface to the infrastructure. Even if you bring your own modem these days, it becomes administered remotely by your ISP. Similar to phreaking being a crime. Even if you have an agreement with your ISP, I'd expect you'd be breaking it and crossing into fraud or toll fraud at the least.

netr0ute 5y ago
> telecom equipment is regulated This is tricky, because "telecom" only has POTS and cable TV within its scope. "Internet" service that just uses ethernet technologies are their own separate thing, and why "Ma Bell" megacorps can get away with their junk Internet service because it's regulated differently than POTS.
mschuster91 5y ago
> I don't know about the FBI specifically but telecom equipment is regulated and in most places it's not legal to roll your own interface to the infrastructure. In the EU, the Directive 2015/2120 [1] enforces the ability of customers to bring their own modems, no matter if you are running fiber, xDSL or DOCSIS. [1]: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/DE/TXT/?uri=celex%3A32015R2120 https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/DE/TXT/?uri=celex%3A...
- emteycz 5y ago
  Nice, but it's not possible to not pay cable modem rent and/or connect a different modem in practice... (Vodafone CZ)
  - mschuster91 5y ago
    Vodafone has gotten under fire here in Germany for the same shady practice too [1]. They are seriously one of the worst providers out there... but they must allow you to connect your own modem. Get a lawyer or go to your equivalent of a consumer protection agency. [1]: https://www.teltarif.de/zwang-zum-router-trotz-routerfreiheit/news/67749.html?page=all https://www.teltarif.de/zwang-zum-router-trotz-routerfreihei...
  - omnimus 5y ago
    UPC got slapped for this before it was sold to Vodafone. So for a time one could buy the modem - its pretty nasty because the rent price is exactly calculated from 2 years the company has warranty from the hw distributor. So basically if you use it for more than 2 years you are paying for payed off hardware for nothing. And of course those devices and users last far more than 2 years (more like 5-10) this is just money printing. But other coment is right. They have to allow you use your device.

dec0dedab0de 5y ago

When I said that I was thinking of a story from 10 or 20 years ago where a bunch of people were increasing their bandwidth by hacking their cablemodems, and they all got raided. I can't seem to find the exact story right now, but Google returns a few similar stories.

LinuxBender 5y ago
I vaguely remember this. IIRC the people raided were those hacking into the CMTS to uncap their modems and their friends modems and I want to say that at least one of them was selling services to uncap modems. Perhaps the notion of hacking was just modding the cable modem to ignore limits being given by the CMTS but either way I believe someone was selling access to this which got the attention of the feds.
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  That seems like an awfully terrible design if the user-controlled equipment is responsible for rate-limiting instead of the CMTS itself.
  - LinuxBender 5y ago
    I agree. No idea if that is still possible these days. Perhaps someone here is involved in the DOCSIS standards or is a cable modem hacker and could offer some insight as to how things may have evolved.