4 ms·

The lower body musculature is too large to be effectively stressed by bodyweight exercise in people fostering any decent level of fitness, i.e., bodyweight squa

by zfnmxt 5y ago

The lower body musculature is too large to be effectively stressed by bodyweight exercise in people fostering any decent level of fitness, i.e., bodyweight squats don't make you stronger. Just because an exercise is hard or makes you sore doesn't mean it's effective.

pastage 5y ago
I've only ever done body weight and know that get more muscle when training. I think you are doing premature optimizing. I know nothing about exercise theory but I know what gets me fat and what makes me strong, I do not care about what is optimal since I do fun things for exercise, not for strength. Do you think this is the difference, the mindset we have in our training.
- zfnmxt 5y ago
  > what makes me strong How do you know what makes you strong? That is, how do you measure it?
multjoy 5y ago
>bodyweight squats don't make you stronger Complete nonsense.
- zfnmxt 5y ago
  I should've written more explicitly: bodyweight squats don't make people who harbor a decent level of fitness stronger. Like any novel stimulus, they will make you stronger for a short while and then it will stop once you've adapted.
  - ricardobeat 5y ago
    It's pretty obvious that the target audience for VR exercise is not 'people who harbor a decent level of fitness'. You're looking at the wrong baseline.
  - zmmmmm 5y ago
    > they will make you stronger for a short while I'm curious about the precise interpretation here. Are you saying increased strength be lost and I will return to baseline before I started exercising? Or are you saying I will get a certain amount of increase and I will maintain it, but it will plateau there? Because I'm just fine with the 2nd scenario. The first would be weird and contradicts my experience (nearly 2 years in ...).
iandanforth 5y ago
I doubt I'll convince the parent, but for the curious about why this comment is utterly wrong and uninformed let's look at how muscles work. In a given set of muscles you have dozens to thousands of motor units. Each is activated by a motor neuron. When recruited the muscle fibers in a motor unit begin producing (or trying to produce) force. The interesting thing is that they arn't all recruited at the same time, when you use 'a muscle' your actually invoking a complex process of recruitment of sub units within that muscle. Moreover these units are not created equally. Some can produce force for a long period of time and are usually weaker, some can produce force very rapidly but tire quickly. This is why when you try to produce a small static force for a long period of time (e.g. hold your arms out straight) your muscles will eventually start shaking and eventually give out. As one set of motor units begin to fatigue the signal to the whole muscle increases, recruiting fast action motor units which are worse at slow holding, and eventually they and all the units are fatigued and you can't produce continued force. If you'd like to play around with a simulation of the above process you can, it's older code but it may still check out: https://github.com/iandanforth/pymuscle https://github.com/iandanforth/pymuscle And to specifically address the issue of 'building muscle', as I've noted there are lots of sub components with different roles. Each of those can grow over time for different reasons and fatigue is one of the main signals for growth. Not the only one, but the notion that the only way to build muscle is to 'tear up' your muscles with huge lifts is both outdated and wrong.
- zfnmxt 5y ago
  I'm having trouble understanding how your comment refutes mine; could you clarify? > Not the only one, but the notion that the only way to build muscle is to 'tear up' your muscles with huge lifts is both outdated and wrong. I think you're misunderstanding my point. The bodyweight squat is ineffective because you cannot change the stimulus; the only training variable you can adjust is the number of squats you do. Because it's a relatively easy exercise, this quickly means that you cannot subject yourself to sufficient stress with it, both for myofibrillar and sarcoplasmic hypertrophy purposes. Nobody in the history of the universe has ever gotten big and strong on bodyweight squats. It has never happened and it never will happen.
  - 5y ago

by zfnmxt 5y ago

pastage 5y ago

I've only ever done body weight and know that get more muscle when training. I think you are doing premature optimizing. I know nothing about exercise theory but I know what gets me fat and what makes me strong, I do not care about what is optimal since I do fun things for exercise, not for strength. Do you think this is the difference, the mindset we have in our training.

zfnmxt 5y ago
> what makes me strong How do you know what makes you strong? That is, how do you measure it?

multjoy 5y ago

>bodyweight squats don't make you stronger Complete nonsense.

zfnmxt 5y ago
I should've written more explicitly: bodyweight squats don't make people who harbor a decent level of fitness stronger. Like any novel stimulus, they will make you stronger for a short while and then it will stop once you've adapted.
- ricardobeat 5y ago
  It's pretty obvious that the target audience for VR exercise is not 'people who harbor a decent level of fitness'. You're looking at the wrong baseline.
- zmmmmm 5y ago
  > they will make you stronger for a short while I'm curious about the precise interpretation here. Are you saying increased strength be lost and I will return to baseline before I started exercising? Or are you saying I will get a certain amount of increase and I will maintain it, but it will plateau there? Because I'm just fine with the 2nd scenario. The first would be weird and contradicts my experience (nearly 2 years in ...).

iandanforth 5y ago

I doubt I'll convince the parent, but for the curious about why this comment is utterly wrong and uninformed let's look at how muscles work. In a given set of muscles you have dozens to thousands of motor units. Each is activated by a motor neuron. When recruited the muscle fibers in a motor unit begin producing (or trying to produce) force. The interesting thing is that they arn't all recruited at the same time, when you use 'a muscle' your actually invoking a complex process of recruitment of sub units within that muscle. Moreover these units are not created equally. Some can produce force for a long period of time and are usually weaker, some can produce force very rapidly but tire quickly. This is why when you try to produce a small static force for a long period of time (e.g. hold your arms out straight) your muscles will eventually start shaking and eventually give out. As one set of motor units begin to fatigue the signal to the whole muscle increases, recruiting fast action motor units which are worse at slow holding, and eventually they and all the units are fatigued and you can't produce continued force. If you'd like to play around with a simulation of the above process you can, it's older code but it may still check out: https://github.com/iandanforth/pymuscle https://github.com/iandanforth/pymuscle And to specifically address the issue of 'building muscle', as I've noted there are lots of sub components with different roles. Each of those can grow over time for different reasons and fatigue is one of the main signals for growth. Not the only one, but the notion that the only way to build muscle is to 'tear up' your muscles with huge lifts is both outdated and wrong.

zfnmxt 5y ago
I'm having trouble understanding how your comment refutes mine; could you clarify? > Not the only one, but the notion that the only way to build muscle is to 'tear up' your muscles with huge lifts is both outdated and wrong. I think you're misunderstanding my point. The bodyweight squat is ineffective because you cannot change the stimulus; the only training variable you can adjust is the number of squats you do. Because it's a relatively easy exercise, this quickly means that you cannot subject yourself to sufficient stress with it, both for myofibrillar and sarcoplasmic hypertrophy purposes. Nobody in the history of the universe has ever gotten big and strong on bodyweight squats. It has never happened and it never will happen.
- 5y ago