7 ms·

it says something about FOMO and being enslaved to the system when people feel 3 days of silence is life changing. Like the brief moment of clarity an addict ex

it says something about FOMO and being enslaved to the system when people feel 3 days of silence is life changing. Like the brief moment of clarity an addict experiences just before succumbing to another cycle of abuse. 3 days isn't enough to build new routines to help you stay sober. It's more like waking up from a dream before falling back into a slumber when in the morning you won't remember what that dream was about. I've been escaping into the woods for several months on long distance hikes. No Internet, no phone or GPS, nobody to talk to but the moon. When the moment is right I have a tent, sleeping bag, a few bits and bobs like a ferro-rod, rescue-blanket first-aid kit, plenty of blister band aids, and whatever else I can fit into a backpack. This has literally healed my addiction, and my crippling life-long depression. I'm really happy people see how powerful (and weird) 3 days offline can be so they feel an urge to tell everyone. I also find it hard to keep it to myself. But I hope their next step is to imagine what 1 or 3 months could do. Truth is you can become a totally new person beyond your wildest imagination. It'll be really weird when you get back because people still think you're same when in reality you've totally become someone else. It's a literal lifehack. Once I came across some distressed farmers in the mountains who lost their cows. I offered to help them searching. They were confused and said you will help for free? Aren't you busy on a hike reaching your destination. So I told them that experiences like these are my destination. The problem with herd animals like they told me was that they were already gone for 3 days. And timing is so important! Apparently if cows are separated too long from their herd, then chances increase they won't bother coming back. If you do catch them they will always stay "naughty" and tend to escape again. But worse! They often bring a friend with them and continue to remain a problem for the farmer forever. I feel like that cow sometimes.

88840-8855 5y ago
- noduerme 5y ago
  What a terrible comment. How do you know if someone has money or not? I read OP's post as meaning they had probably given up making money in favor of living a richer life.
  - 88840-8855 5y ago
    - JSavageOne 5y ago
      You don't need any money to go in the woods. Stop complaining and vilifying other people to rationalize your false beliefs and hatred towards the world. How ironic that you even have the gall to say "I think you are terrible", perhaps you should heed the OP's advice and take some time offline because clearly you're a toxic person.
      - joeberon 5y ago
      - 88840-8855 5y ago
        stavros 5y ago
        I love how one comment after you told someone they're terrible you're chastising someone for insulting you, I find that very funny.
        88840-8855 5y ago
        I was called terrible. You are quoting wrong! Furthermore, because of having a different opinion I was downvoted. Hence, I deceided to self-censor myself.
        stavros 5y ago
        I'm fairly sure the comment you censored contained the words "You are terrible" in response to "what a terrible comment". They called your comment terrible and you called them terrible. You aren't being downvoted because of the opinion but because of the way you chose to express it.
- chmod775 5y ago
  For most people 3 months is about two years worth of paid vacation days. And that's if you don't get a doctors note to get some time off for your mental health. Certainly possible.
  - uoaei 5y ago
    I really think "most people" is a severe exaggeration. Even in the US "most people" could probably be lumped into per diem, contract, gig, or remarkably tenuous work arrangements.
    - chmod775 5y ago
      > Even in the US The US is the exception, not the rule. Most countries have a mandatory minimum of around 24 paid vacation days / year. Also usually a bunch of national holidays to plan your vacation around.
      - uoaei 5y ago
        I dunno, this feels pretty West-centric. There are literally billions of people in the global south scrapping (a generous and vague term) for a living, to whom labor laws simply don't apply at the level of vacation days.
  - stopping 5y ago
    I can't imagine not being able to take a single extra day off for two years straight. I think the only realistic options for most people are to (1) quit and take extended time off between jobs, or (2) get approval for unpaid leave. Unfortunately most jobs don't have an option for the latter. And even if your job does offer unpaid leave, I don't think I could truly "disconnect" knowing that work is potentially piling up in the background and waiting for me when I get back.
    - noduerme 5y ago
      >> I don't think I could truly "disconnect" knowing that work is potentially piling up in the background and waiting for me when I get back. Knowing you've got work waiting when you want it / need to make money is a blessing, not a curse. Having to worry about it piling up sucks. But basically it means both options are available to you: (1) take extended time off, or (2) get approval, because you're necessary enough that the work will still be waiting for you when you get back. There's also (3) pick up jobs while you're traveling - teaching English, bartending, working for a nonprofit that will cover your housing, or something more creative. That's how most of the long-term travelers I know did it. The only basic requirement is being sick enough of everything here to take the first step off the ledge. When I left my job and left America, I had $15k in the bank, way more than the OP, but it was still scary and I was giving up a $60k job to do it. Hands down the only good decision I ever made in my life, that gave me a real sense of who I was. I would never have gotten to that knowledge, no matter how much more I made staying in the US; I would have just become more of a slave to the dollar, less and less inclined to seek new experiences (like I'm afraid I'm becoming now).
- DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  when I set out the first time I had just 2K in my pocket, I struggled to keep a job down, and I thought of killing myself. Going to the woods became a metaphor (an in joke only I knew) that was to end me. Nobody knew but my intention wasn't ever to come back. My plans included a bottle of vodka, various hard drugs, a rope, and me hanging in a tree. I'm glad I didn't do it and instead rediscovered how I felt as a 6yro boy being told to get out of the house into the the pouring rain by my dad. There were woods all around where I grew up and I remember complaining about boredom. My dad had this rule where he would kick me out if I complained about being bored. So I went to the woods and gave names to "my trees" and built shelters to sit and imagined what it was like to be a native American. If you're looking for work you should work on yourself first and not blame your environment. Nobody will stop you from complaining of course but it's ultimately not getting you anywhere. Some of us have better starting points but I'm living proof that even if your whole family is abusive garbage, you can optimize your chances of luck in life. If your environment doesn't support you it's on you to change it. Even if that means leaving your country, your friends, your family. Even if it means leaving your kids! Because what kind of a role model can are you to them when all you spew is toxicity? They're better without you in that case. So it's better to fix yourself. Money, job, income doesn't play a role in this when the only future you can imagine is you not hugging a tree but hanging in one.
- cko 5y ago
  "You don't need a million dollars to do nothing, man. Take a look at my cousin. He's broke and he don't do shit." ~Lawrence, Office Space (1999)
- notahacker 5y ago
  I met more travellers who had only ever done bar work than tech workers with 500k in the bank when backpacking
- inglor_cz 5y ago
  You repeat the word "overpaid" in your another (dead) comment. Envy? How would you determine who is "overpaid" and who is not? Have you ever been overpaid in your own opinion? Why?
noduerme 5y ago
I was going to say that the line in the article >> This new mode of living came with another alien sensation: that of having tons of time. describes what it's like for me if I don't smoke or drink for a few days. You say you healed your addiction and depression by going off-grid. I lived off-grid for a long time and it probably made me more of an addict. But at least I was living a genuine life, meeting people and ending up in weird situations that stimulated me. Not in the depressing mundane world of social media. Your post makes me remember that, and it's something I very much want to get back to. The original article makes me sad that people a few years younger than me are so addicted to this screen that 3 days away is as difficult and mind-boggling for them as 3 days without booze is for me.
- DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  > I lived off-grid for a long time and it probably made me more of an addict. it was the same for me. The first time when I returned back to civilization I was overwhelmed by the emotions of being among humans again. Shopping malls, busy side walks, traffic or more than 3 people in a room almost gave me panic attacks. The addict in me said: "you've got so much catching up to do". "surely you earned the right to party a little after all this abstinence?". I've been an addict all life so it would be preposterous to think I could kick the habit within a few months. What it did give me was the confidence to face my own feelings all by myself? Feelings I never faced being sober. My second hike was well planned out and I cut down my drinking and smoking well before I left. Suddenly there was a destination (on the map) I had to reach in very specific time, a level of fitness required, a positive state of mind I wanted to be in much more than a blunt, a scotch or the approval of the opposite sex. Also what contributed was that I gradually replaced quite a number of relationships with more positive ones that supported and believed in me, and who didn't really know or care about the old me. I'll continue to struggle because there is no cure for the human condition. It's not _one_ thing I have to do and some months later it's all different. It's playing the long game and realizing that even if I sometimes lose myself I must get back up.
  - noduerme 5y ago
    Coming back is a shock - I was out for 10 years (not all in the wilderness, but mostly renting in small towns or camping or living in a van in Asia, Europe, Australia). I had the misfortune of coming back to the US a month before Trump won the election. I had the double misfortune of my homecoming flight being to Las Vegas for my brother's bachelor party. The fucking darkness. The recessed lighting, the militarized look of the signs and vehicles. I still remember turning on the TV in the hotel room and listening to this horrible shit pour out of the only channels... things I couldn't imagine ten years earlier. It took a couple years before it sank in and the daily shocks started to numb me. And encumber my mind. But I'd been an alkie on the road, and when the pandemic hit all the worst of that came back. Spent most of the last couple years inside a bottle, with no way out. Nowhere to go. Nowhere you can go. Girlfriend likes to drink, but tells me I should sober up. Girlfriend seems like the reason I drink sometimes, but she's not; just the sense of being trapped. When your only outlet is through a screen, or patio outside the bar with a few neighbors, everything narrows down. I know a guy who just got back from ice climbing in Utah and I think, well, fuck it's too late for me to ever do something like that. I really feel trapped. Hey anyway, thank you for sharing this. It does give me some inspiration. You're the kind of person I hope I run into out there, when or if I do get out there again.
bjourne 5y ago
I don't know anything about you except what I can gather from glancing at your HN profile. But... from your 31k karma points gathered in ten years and your HN posting frequency, it seems that you haven't healed your addiction. You are just as addicted as the rest of us, communicating on a message board with strangers who doesn't know you personally.
- DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  > You are just as addicted as the rest of us not my intention to say "I'm better than anyone". Only yardstick I have is my past behavior not others behavior or judgement. And I do a lot better today where I'm sometimes absent for months and at other times I log in once or twice a day. For me I consider myself better than I was (not better than others) because I no longer get anxious when I don't carry my phone. And I know I'm happier, which doesn't mean that the same approach is a good idea for others (I wouldn't do it 20 years younger or when raising little kids). Hey, this website is free!
taneq 5y ago
Sounds like nobody depends on you. Must be nice, in some ways, but empty in others.
thesuitonym 5y ago
How do you just disappear into the woods for a month or more? Don't you have rent or a mortgage to pay? When you get back, how do you resume life? I presume you're not regularly employed (This isn't a negative thing, I'm not making a value statement, I'd also like to be irregularly employed), but if you're self employed, how do you get your clients to accept that there are just whole parts of the year where they can't reach you? Is it just generational wealth that allows you to do this?
- psyc 5y ago
  Every bill I have is on autopay. I usually do regular 1099 contract work a few months per year. I must say I don't understand the need to invoke generational wealth on a forum for people who can bill anywhere from $60-$??? per hour.

88840-8855 5y ago

noduerme 5y ago
What a terrible comment. How do you know if someone has money or not? I read OP's post as meaning they had probably given up making money in favor of living a richer life.
- 88840-8855 5y ago
  - JSavageOne 5y ago
    You don't need any money to go in the woods. Stop complaining and vilifying other people to rationalize your false beliefs and hatred towards the world. How ironic that you even have the gall to say "I think you are terrible", perhaps you should heed the OP's advice and take some time offline because clearly you're a toxic person.
    - joeberon 5y ago
    - 88840-8855 5y ago
      - stavros 5y ago
        I love how one comment after you told someone they're terrible you're chastising someone for insulting you, I find that very funny.
        88840-8855 5y ago
        I was called terrible. You are quoting wrong! Furthermore, because of having a different opinion I was downvoted. Hence, I deceided to self-censor myself.
        stavros 5y ago
        I'm fairly sure the comment you censored contained the words "You are terrible" in response to "what a terrible comment". They called your comment terrible and you called them terrible. You aren't being downvoted because of the opinion but because of the way you chose to express it.
chmod775 5y ago
For most people 3 months is about two years worth of paid vacation days. And that's if you don't get a doctors note to get some time off for your mental health. Certainly possible.
- uoaei 5y ago
  I really think "most people" is a severe exaggeration. Even in the US "most people" could probably be lumped into per diem, contract, gig, or remarkably tenuous work arrangements.
  - chmod775 5y ago
    > Even in the US The US is the exception, not the rule. Most countries have a mandatory minimum of around 24 paid vacation days / year. Also usually a bunch of national holidays to plan your vacation around.
    - uoaei 5y ago
      I dunno, this feels pretty West-centric. There are literally billions of people in the global south scrapping (a generous and vague term) for a living, to whom labor laws simply don't apply at the level of vacation days.
- stopping 5y ago
  I can't imagine not being able to take a single extra day off for two years straight. I think the only realistic options for most people are to (1) quit and take extended time off between jobs, or (2) get approval for unpaid leave. Unfortunately most jobs don't have an option for the latter. And even if your job does offer unpaid leave, I don't think I could truly "disconnect" knowing that work is potentially piling up in the background and waiting for me when I get back.
  - noduerme 5y ago
    >> I don't think I could truly "disconnect" knowing that work is potentially piling up in the background and waiting for me when I get back. Knowing you've got work waiting when you want it / need to make money is a blessing, not a curse. Having to worry about it piling up sucks. But basically it means both options are available to you: (1) take extended time off, or (2) get approval, because you're necessary enough that the work will still be waiting for you when you get back. There's also (3) pick up jobs while you're traveling - teaching English, bartending, working for a nonprofit that will cover your housing, or something more creative. That's how most of the long-term travelers I know did it. The only basic requirement is being sick enough of everything here to take the first step off the ledge. When I left my job and left America, I had $15k in the bank, way more than the OP, but it was still scary and I was giving up a $60k job to do it. Hands down the only good decision I ever made in my life, that gave me a real sense of who I was. I would never have gotten to that knowledge, no matter how much more I made staying in the US; I would have just become more of a slave to the dollar, less and less inclined to seek new experiences (like I'm afraid I'm becoming now).
DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
when I set out the first time I had just 2K in my pocket, I struggled to keep a job down, and I thought of killing myself. Going to the woods became a metaphor (an in joke only I knew) that was to end me. Nobody knew but my intention wasn't ever to come back. My plans included a bottle of vodka, various hard drugs, a rope, and me hanging in a tree. I'm glad I didn't do it and instead rediscovered how I felt as a 6yro boy being told to get out of the house into the the pouring rain by my dad. There were woods all around where I grew up and I remember complaining about boredom. My dad had this rule where he would kick me out if I complained about being bored. So I went to the woods and gave names to "my trees" and built shelters to sit and imagined what it was like to be a native American. If you're looking for work you should work on yourself first and not blame your environment. Nobody will stop you from complaining of course but it's ultimately not getting you anywhere. Some of us have better starting points but I'm living proof that even if your whole family is abusive garbage, you can optimize your chances of luck in life. If your environment doesn't support you it's on you to change it. Even if that means leaving your country, your friends, your family. Even if it means leaving your kids! Because what kind of a role model can are you to them when all you spew is toxicity? They're better without you in that case. So it's better to fix yourself. Money, job, income doesn't play a role in this when the only future you can imagine is you not hugging a tree but hanging in one.
cko 5y ago
"You don't need a million dollars to do nothing, man. Take a look at my cousin. He's broke and he don't do shit." ~Lawrence, Office Space (1999)
notahacker 5y ago
I met more travellers who had only ever done bar work than tech workers with 500k in the bank when backpacking
inglor_cz 5y ago
You repeat the word "overpaid" in your another (dead) comment. Envy? How would you determine who is "overpaid" and who is not? Have you ever been overpaid in your own opinion? Why?

noduerme 5y ago

I was going to say that the line in the article >> This new mode of living came with another alien sensation: that of having tons of time. describes what it's like for me if I don't smoke or drink for a few days. You say you healed your addiction and depression by going off-grid. I lived off-grid for a long time and it probably made me more of an addict. But at least I was living a genuine life, meeting people and ending up in weird situations that stimulated me. Not in the depressing mundane world of social media. Your post makes me remember that, and it's something I very much want to get back to. The original article makes me sad that people a few years younger than me are so addicted to this screen that 3 days away is as difficult and mind-boggling for them as 3 days without booze is for me.

DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
> I lived off-grid for a long time and it probably made me more of an addict. it was the same for me. The first time when I returned back to civilization I was overwhelmed by the emotions of being among humans again. Shopping malls, busy side walks, traffic or more than 3 people in a room almost gave me panic attacks. The addict in me said: "you've got so much catching up to do". "surely you earned the right to party a little after all this abstinence?". I've been an addict all life so it would be preposterous to think I could kick the habit within a few months. What it did give me was the confidence to face my own feelings all by myself? Feelings I never faced being sober. My second hike was well planned out and I cut down my drinking and smoking well before I left. Suddenly there was a destination (on the map) I had to reach in very specific time, a level of fitness required, a positive state of mind I wanted to be in much more than a blunt, a scotch or the approval of the opposite sex. Also what contributed was that I gradually replaced quite a number of relationships with more positive ones that supported and believed in me, and who didn't really know or care about the old me. I'll continue to struggle because there is no cure for the human condition. It's not _one_ thing I have to do and some months later it's all different. It's playing the long game and realizing that even if I sometimes lose myself I must get back up.
- noduerme 5y ago
  Coming back is a shock - I was out for 10 years (not all in the wilderness, but mostly renting in small towns or camping or living in a van in Asia, Europe, Australia). I had the misfortune of coming back to the US a month before Trump won the election. I had the double misfortune of my homecoming flight being to Las Vegas for my brother's bachelor party. The fucking darkness. The recessed lighting, the militarized look of the signs and vehicles. I still remember turning on the TV in the hotel room and listening to this horrible shit pour out of the only channels... things I couldn't imagine ten years earlier. It took a couple years before it sank in and the daily shocks started to numb me. And encumber my mind. But I'd been an alkie on the road, and when the pandemic hit all the worst of that came back. Spent most of the last couple years inside a bottle, with no way out. Nowhere to go. Nowhere you can go. Girlfriend likes to drink, but tells me I should sober up. Girlfriend seems like the reason I drink sometimes, but she's not; just the sense of being trapped. When your only outlet is through a screen, or patio outside the bar with a few neighbors, everything narrows down. I know a guy who just got back from ice climbing in Utah and I think, well, fuck it's too late for me to ever do something like that. I really feel trapped. Hey anyway, thank you for sharing this. It does give me some inspiration. You're the kind of person I hope I run into out there, when or if I do get out there again.

bjourne 5y ago

I don't know anything about you except what I can gather from glancing at your HN profile. But... from your 31k karma points gathered in ten years and your HN posting frequency, it seems that you haven't healed your addiction. You are just as addicted as the rest of us, communicating on a message board with strangers who doesn't know you personally.

DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
> You are just as addicted as the rest of us not my intention to say "I'm better than anyone". Only yardstick I have is my past behavior not others behavior or judgement. And I do a lot better today where I'm sometimes absent for months and at other times I log in once or twice a day. For me I consider myself better than I was (not better than others) because I no longer get anxious when I don't carry my phone. And I know I'm happier, which doesn't mean that the same approach is a good idea for others (I wouldn't do it 20 years younger or when raising little kids). Hey, this website is free!

taneq 5y ago

Sounds like nobody depends on you. Must be nice, in some ways, but empty in others.

thesuitonym 5y ago

How do you just disappear into the woods for a month or more? Don't you have rent or a mortgage to pay? When you get back, how do you resume life? I presume you're not regularly employed (This isn't a negative thing, I'm not making a value statement, I'd also like to be irregularly employed), but if you're self employed, how do you get your clients to accept that there are just whole parts of the year where they can't reach you? Is it just generational wealth that allows you to do this?

psyc 5y ago
Every bill I have is on autopay. I usually do regular 1099 contract work a few months per year. I must say I don't understand the need to invoke generational wealth on a forum for people who can bill anywhere from $60-$??? per hour.