4 ms·

It's happening to them too. Returns fraud is booming business. Not trying to excuse anything, just explain why some people are getting crappy used products (sl

It's happening to them too. Returns fraud is booming business. Not trying to excuse anything, just explain why some people are getting crappy used products (sloppy returns QA) or aggressive customer services denying consumer rights (burnt retailer). Ultimately it's all on the retailer, but it's also a cost we'll end up bearing. Criminals ruin things for everyone.

beebmam 5y ago
Yep, and that's why fraudsters should spend decades in prison
- gruez 5y ago
  Decades? Murderers get less than that.
throwaway3rr 5y ago
quantumduck 5y ago
Yup, it's a business now on internet boards. Here is a link to one such telegram group: https://t.me/refundingclub https://t.me/refundingclub There are tons more. The basic philosophy is that they use a bunch of social engineering techniques that are specific to companies and use them to get refund for people and then take a cut (usually 20-35%). The likely picked up these techniques through trial and error or from other people running similar services. Their most common targets are amazon, PayPal, almost all electronics retailers, tons of clothing companies, Walmart, target, Costco, etc.
- Gareth321 5y ago
  Every time these scumbags succeed it hurts all of us just a little bit. Society becomes just a little bit less trusting. High trust societies are so much better to live in. I wonder how countries go about engineering high trust cultures. I suppose the first step is actively finding these people and putting them in prison.
  - gruez 5y ago
    >I suppose the first step is actively finding these people and putting them in prison. what do you think the police are for? the FBI also investigates wire fraud cases. unfortunately both do not have enough resources to investigate $200 frauds. Hell, in some jurisdictions they don't even bother with $900 thefts.
    - minerva23 5y ago
      > what do you think the police are for? General beatdowns. Detectives are what you're thinking of. Most people want detectives, few people want harassment and fines (or death) over nothing more than some cop's power trip or petty things (like jay walking when it blocks no traffic and is completely safe). Granted, this perspective is colored by American policing. I know some other countries have it better.
    - oliwarner 5y ago
      This is what I think the police are for but as you say, it's hard to figure out what they actually are for these days. And to be clear, it's not just the police, decades-long underfunding of the public legal systems, prisons, and all the services that are supposed to stop people ending up that far in the first place. But I'm not sure it's good to stop expecting the police to deal with this. That sort of surrender to criminality would be a dark step for humanity.

beebmam 5y ago

Yep, and that's why fraudsters should spend decades in prison

gruez 5y ago
Decades? Murderers get less than that.

throwaway3rr 5y ago

quantumduck 5y ago

Yup, it's a business now on internet boards. Here is a link to one such telegram group: https://t.me/refundingclub https://t.me/refundingclub There are tons more. The basic philosophy is that they use a bunch of social engineering techniques that are specific to companies and use them to get refund for people and then take a cut (usually 20-35%). The likely picked up these techniques through trial and error or from other people running similar services. Their most common targets are amazon, PayPal, almost all electronics retailers, tons of clothing companies, Walmart, target, Costco, etc.

Gareth321 5y ago
Every time these scumbags succeed it hurts all of us just a little bit. Society becomes just a little bit less trusting. High trust societies are so much better to live in. I wonder how countries go about engineering high trust cultures. I suppose the first step is actively finding these people and putting them in prison.
- gruez 5y ago
  >I suppose the first step is actively finding these people and putting them in prison. what do you think the police are for? the FBI also investigates wire fraud cases. unfortunately both do not have enough resources to investigate $200 frauds. Hell, in some jurisdictions they don't even bother with $900 thefts.
  - minerva23 5y ago
    > what do you think the police are for? General beatdowns. Detectives are what you're thinking of. Most people want detectives, few people want harassment and fines (or death) over nothing more than some cop's power trip or petty things (like jay walking when it blocks no traffic and is completely safe). Granted, this perspective is colored by American policing. I know some other countries have it better.
  - oliwarner 5y ago
    This is what I think the police are for but as you say, it's hard to figure out what they actually are for these days. And to be clear, it's not just the police, decades-long underfunding of the public legal systems, prisons, and all the services that are supposed to stop people ending up that far in the first place. But I'm not sure it's good to stop expecting the police to deal with this. That sort of surrender to criminality would be a dark step for humanity.