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"industry is better at organizing capital and labor to deliver a product/service than government" At some level this is always true. Are there any countries wi

"industry is better at organizing capital and labor to deliver a product/service than government" At some level this is always true. Are there any countries with competitive industries that don't have corporations doing the actual work even if the government accounts for 100% of their revenues? Isn't this the basic premise behind the economic revolutions in India and China, that government industries are significantly less efficient than private industries?

BurningFrog 5y ago
Rephrasing makes it clearer: An open market where anyone is allowed to compete is better at organizing capital and labor to deliver a product/service than a single monopolist organization.
- avmich 5y ago
  Remind you, NASA did Apollo project in Soviet Gosplan style, when all manufacturers were working on the same central plan, while USSR supported at the time former Sergey Korolyov's team (Korolyov himself died in early 1966), their fierce competitors under Vladimir Chelomey and Mikhail Yangel's bureau as well, the latter leading to resources being distributed much less focused. That also allowed Zond program (Chelomey's Proton and Korolyov's Soyuz spacecraft) and automatic Moon explorers (Lunokhods and three sample return missions), so diversity did bring some fruits, but the manned system - which wasn't that far from working - was scrapped and Energiya-Buran project was launched. It brought results, but too late to be used with the terminally ill country.
  - BurningFrog 5y ago
    The "Soviet Gosplan style" projects tend to work for the top 2-3 priorities of the country. The soviets did well in military power, international sports, and maybe one other thing, while the rest of society stagnated.
simiones 5y ago
I don't think any industry/free market can compare for example to the war-time mobilization of industry displayed in the USA and the Soviet Union during WWII. For huge scale production, centralized planning can't be beat, at least for a period of time. I believe the same is true of the early space race, or the Manhattan Project.
jvanderbot 5y ago
Efficiency isn't the key: Appetite is. Industry didn't have the appetite for this until very, very recently. To get anything done, gov had to create a market for space exploration technologies and hope for efficiency to pick up in the industry. For the longest time, NASA existed almost exclusively to demonstrate technology and to create an environment where talent and tech could mature in the US. Blanket statements like "It'd have gone better with Industry" are potentially true, but miss the issue entirely: No highly-funded market for pictures of Mars, Neptune, Venus existed, essentially ever, including today.

BurningFrog 5y ago

Rephrasing makes it clearer: An open market where anyone is allowed to compete is better at organizing capital and labor to deliver a product/service than a single monopolist organization.

avmich 5y ago
Remind you, NASA did Apollo project in Soviet Gosplan style, when all manufacturers were working on the same central plan, while USSR supported at the time former Sergey Korolyov's team (Korolyov himself died in early 1966), their fierce competitors under Vladimir Chelomey and Mikhail Yangel's bureau as well, the latter leading to resources being distributed much less focused. That also allowed Zond program (Chelomey's Proton and Korolyov's Soyuz spacecraft) and automatic Moon explorers (Lunokhods and three sample return missions), so diversity did bring some fruits, but the manned system - which wasn't that far from working - was scrapped and Energiya-Buran project was launched. It brought results, but too late to be used with the terminally ill country.
- BurningFrog 5y ago
  The "Soviet Gosplan style" projects tend to work for the top 2-3 priorities of the country. The soviets did well in military power, international sports, and maybe one other thing, while the rest of society stagnated.

simiones 5y ago

I don't think any industry/free market can compare for example to the war-time mobilization of industry displayed in the USA and the Soviet Union during WWII. For huge scale production, centralized planning can't be beat, at least for a period of time. I believe the same is true of the early space race, or the Manhattan Project.

jvanderbot 5y ago

Efficiency isn't the key: Appetite is. Industry didn't have the appetite for this until very, very recently. To get anything done, gov had to create a market for space exploration technologies and hope for efficiency to pick up in the industry. For the longest time, NASA existed almost exclusively to demonstrate technology and to create an environment where talent and tech could mature in the US. Blanket statements like "It'd have gone better with Industry" are potentially true, but miss the issue entirely: No highly-funded market for pictures of Mars, Neptune, Venus existed, essentially ever, including today.