5 ms·

They're honking for 16-18 hours per day. For people that live near the convoy, they've been able to sleep for over two weeks due to this. I have friends and fam

They're honking for 16-18 hours per day. For people that live near the convoy, they've been able to sleep for over two weeks due to this. I have friends and family affected by this. I'm fairly sure this constitutes torture if you don't have the resources to up and leave your residence for days at a time in order to sleep.

kbelder 5y ago
How are the protestors sleeping?
- purephase 5y ago
  You do know that they're in vehicles that they're moving in and out of the city, correct? It's not like they're all just parked in one spot and staying there the entire time. Unlike people with fixed addresses, they can just up and move to a quiet part of the city to sleep, and then drive back after.
moralestapia 5y ago
- cf100clunk 5y ago
  No, a dog barking 16-18 hours per day is illegal almost everywhere in Canada and the person(s) responsible face fines, at the least.
  - moralestapia 5y ago
    - cf100clunk 5y ago
      A line in a Traveling Wilburys song goes "everything is legal as long as you don't get caught." That's what came to mind as I read your reply, which tacitly agrees with my parent comment.
      - pvg 5y ago
        It's specifically about Jersey, a sentiment older than the song and one that also pops up in Hamilton.
      - moralestapia 5y ago
        That's a nice quote, thanks. I'm arguing a slightly different thing, that authorities are quite aware and tolerant of the situation in many cases, so they don't care to do much.
- purephase 5y ago
  - moralestapia 5y ago
    Yes, I am. Noise pollution has the same effect on people regardless of the source. You pretty much proved my point by diminishing the one particular source of noise that you personally don't consider "as bad".
    - purephase 5y ago
      - moralestapia 5y ago
        Chill, no need to curse to get your point across as it only paints a poor image of you. Anyway, noise is noise, whether it comes from a truck, or a dog, a party, or w/e. If you're unable to understand that, then I guess this discussion is futile.
        rpeden 5y ago
        As a counterpoint - it's not the same regardless of the source. This is happening in my old neighbourhood, and several of my friends still live in the area so I've heard firsthand accounts. It's not just trucks blowing their air horns. That would have been annoying. A bunch of them installed train horns and during the first week were honking them 24/7. It was loud enough to cause hearing damage indoors. I'd be impressed if a dog could bark that loud.
    - smokelegend 5y ago
      14-16hrs? Seems a bit weak. How about 24hrs? Now that's torture, or as we Americans like to claim "enhanced interrogation"... [Enemy combatants were exposed to sensory deprivation which included 24hrs of American heavy metal music and 24hrs of flood spotlights to prevent sleeping.] I get it, after living peacefully before these protests started it might appear as torture, however it is again just annoying behavior not torture. As mentioned by other comments, ear plugs are a thing, sleeping pills could help, glass of warm milk perhaps. You have options in this scenario, unlike when you are being physically tortured, you have no options but to endure.
- dang 5y ago
  Please do not posting unsubstantive and/or flamebait comments to HN. You can make your substantive points without that. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. Note this one: "Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."
tablespoon 5y ago
> They're honking for 16-18 hours per day. For people that live near the convoy, they've been able to sleep for over two weeks due to this. I have friends and family affected by this. I'm fairly sure this constitutes torture if you don't have the resources to up and leave your residence for days at a time in order to sleep. Are earplugs not a thing in Canada? Calling honking torture is ridiculous hyperbole. That word should be reserved for the extremely serious kinds of acts it's normally used to describe, lest it become effectively meaningless. Words themselves don't have any power, and if you try to harness the power of a concept by misusing a word that refers to it, you just cause the word's definition to shift and to weaken its association to the concept (potentially making that concept much harder to access and refer to).
- endemic 5y ago
  Earplugs just deaden sound, they don't eliminate it.
- throw10920 5y ago
  I challenge you to find earplugs that can be worn 24h a day without any physical discomfort, provide 60dB of attenuation across a wide range of frequencies (these horns probably span low 100's of Hz to mid kHz), and are reasonably inexpensive. Even if you could find such beasts (which I don't think you can), then you have the problem that you effectively can't use your hearing. You thought that social interactions were hard with a mask? Imagine not being able to use your hearing at all. (yes, 60 dB is necessary because that's how much you'll need in order to sleep - the human ear has an incredibly large dynamic range and even 30 dB_SPL conversations are enough to keep some people awake for hours) As it stands, many of the residents near these protests are being subjected to low-level sleep deprivation, which is literally torture (as in, used as such by organizations who actually want to extract information or confessions from people). To clarify - it's not honking that's torture, it's sustained honking at a duration and intensity that will cause sleep deprivation and other psychological damage. Completely independently of the reason that these people are protesting - this particular means is not humane.
  - tablespoon 5y ago

kbelder 5y ago

How are the protestors sleeping?

purephase 5y ago
You do know that they're in vehicles that they're moving in and out of the city, correct? It's not like they're all just parked in one spot and staying there the entire time. Unlike people with fixed addresses, they can just up and move to a quiet part of the city to sleep, and then drive back after.

moralestapia 5y ago

cf100clunk 5y ago
No, a dog barking 16-18 hours per day is illegal almost everywhere in Canada and the person(s) responsible face fines, at the least.
- moralestapia 5y ago
  - cf100clunk 5y ago
    A line in a Traveling Wilburys song goes "everything is legal as long as you don't get caught." That's what came to mind as I read your reply, which tacitly agrees with my parent comment.
    - pvg 5y ago
      It's specifically about Jersey, a sentiment older than the song and one that also pops up in Hamilton.
    - moralestapia 5y ago
      That's a nice quote, thanks. I'm arguing a slightly different thing, that authorities are quite aware and tolerant of the situation in many cases, so they don't care to do much.
purephase 5y ago
- moralestapia 5y ago
  Yes, I am. Noise pollution has the same effect on people regardless of the source. You pretty much proved my point by diminishing the one particular source of noise that you personally don't consider "as bad".
  - purephase 5y ago
    - moralestapia 5y ago
      Chill, no need to curse to get your point across as it only paints a poor image of you. Anyway, noise is noise, whether it comes from a truck, or a dog, a party, or w/e. If you're unable to understand that, then I guess this discussion is futile.
      - rpeden 5y ago
        As a counterpoint - it's not the same regardless of the source. This is happening in my old neighbourhood, and several of my friends still live in the area so I've heard firsthand accounts. It's not just trucks blowing their air horns. That would have been annoying. A bunch of them installed train horns and during the first week were honking them 24/7. It was loud enough to cause hearing damage indoors. I'd be impressed if a dog could bark that loud.
  - smokelegend 5y ago
    14-16hrs? Seems a bit weak. How about 24hrs? Now that's torture, or as we Americans like to claim "enhanced interrogation"... [Enemy combatants were exposed to sensory deprivation which included 24hrs of American heavy metal music and 24hrs of flood spotlights to prevent sleeping.] I get it, after living peacefully before these protests started it might appear as torture, however it is again just annoying behavior not torture. As mentioned by other comments, ear plugs are a thing, sleeping pills could help, glass of warm milk perhaps. You have options in this scenario, unlike when you are being physically tortured, you have no options but to endure.
dang 5y ago
Please do not posting unsubstantive and/or flamebait comments to HN. You can make your substantive points without that. If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful. Note this one: "Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive."

tablespoon 5y ago

> They're honking for 16-18 hours per day. For people that live near the convoy, they've been able to sleep for over two weeks due to this. I have friends and family affected by this. I'm fairly sure this constitutes torture if you don't have the resources to up and leave your residence for days at a time in order to sleep. Are earplugs not a thing in Canada? Calling honking torture is ridiculous hyperbole. That word should be reserved for the extremely serious kinds of acts it's normally used to describe, lest it become effectively meaningless. Words themselves don't have any power, and if you try to harness the power of a concept by misusing a word that refers to it, you just cause the word's definition to shift and to weaken its association to the concept (potentially making that concept much harder to access and refer to).

endemic 5y ago
Earplugs just deaden sound, they don't eliminate it.
throw10920 5y ago
I challenge you to find earplugs that can be worn 24h a day without any physical discomfort, provide 60dB of attenuation across a wide range of frequencies (these horns probably span low 100's of Hz to mid kHz), and are reasonably inexpensive. Even if you could find such beasts (which I don't think you can), then you have the problem that you effectively can't use your hearing. You thought that social interactions were hard with a mask? Imagine not being able to use your hearing at all. (yes, 60 dB is necessary because that's how much you'll need in order to sleep - the human ear has an incredibly large dynamic range and even 30 dB_SPL conversations are enough to keep some people awake for hours) As it stands, many of the residents near these protests are being subjected to low-level sleep deprivation, which is literally torture (as in, used as such by organizations who actually want to extract information or confessions from people). To clarify - it's not honking that's torture, it's sustained honking at a duration and intensity that will cause sleep deprivation and other psychological damage. Completely independently of the reason that these people are protesting - this particular means is not humane.
- tablespoon 5y ago