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It seems like Apple is really tempting fate here. These onerous and anti-competitive rules will surely invite more regulation.

Guest42 5y ago
Agreed. It seems as though they've adopted a never-surrender mindset and will continue down the current path regardless of circumstances.
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  I think this is going to be a wake-up call, not just for Apple but big tech in general. They're used to the US where regulators, when they even exist, can trivially be worked around with lobbying or a half-assed, bad-faith "solution" like this one. It seems like this kind of strategy no longer works in the EU.
  - realusername 5y ago
    They dig their own grave, they have way too much market power while simultaneously reducing as much as they can the taxes they provide in the EU, their contempt is the cherry on top. I don't even see anything which could make them not get hammered.
    - chasil 5y ago
      There should be an F-Droid for Apple, that only accepts contributions in the form of source code. Both Apple and Google should be compelled to admit anything from F-Droid into their relevant app stores, at whatever price the developer sets. When an app developer is proscribed, this option will allow access to mobile platforms that Apple or Google would otherwise revoke and ban. There is enough attention on this issue now to force this to happen. https://nypost.com/2022/01/31/googles-online-ad-business-would-be-dismantled-under-bill-gaining-bipartisan-support/ https://nypost.com/2022/01/31/googles-online-ad-business-wou...
- toyg 5y ago
  I reckon Cook has accepted that the party will end soon; and so they will milk the market for as much as they can, until the very last day. That's the only explanation that respects his intelligence.
Nextgrid 5y ago
This is typical "big tech" that is used to getting away with anything with the worst-case scenario being a slap on the wrist, way after the damage was caused and money was earned - very common in the US. It seems like EU regulators are starting to wake up (both this and the recent GDPR developments) and are able to see straight through the bullshit and recognize bad-faith behavior.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- arlcode 5y ago
  In Europe, big tech pays very little taxes, provides very few jobs and exfiltrates mountains of personal data to foreign intelligence services. It's politically very easy to bring out the big guns here for European politicians. At least the US government can be brought to the negotiation table if it turns out to be a problem.
  - Nextgrid 5y ago
    > It's politically very easy to bring out the big guns here for European politicians. If this results in a more competitive environment where we're less stalked & screwed by big tech then why not? The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
criddell 5y ago
I really don’t understand their strategy here. I was listening to the ATP podcast. All three hosts are big fans of Apple, they use and promote Apple products, and make all or some of their living selling apps. They all think Apple is making a huge mistake here. Is there anybody who thinks Apple’s recent moves are going to be good for them long term? When even your biggest fans think you are being petulant and foolish, maybe it’s time to reevaluate?
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  > When even your biggest fans think you are being petulant and foolish, maybe it’s time to reevaluate? Has there ever been a situation where a public company has valued consumer trust or goodwill? To me it seems like it only matters when consumers actually have a choice and you need to convince them to give you money - once you've locked them in (because of contracts or anti-competitive practices), it doesn't really matter and you can (and should) milk them out of every dollar until you can't (as in competition or regulation disrupts the status-quo).
  - criddell 5y ago
    Apple’s fight right now is with regulators. You might get away with screwing consumers when your competitors are as bad or worse than you, but governments are a different thing all together. Did the lawyers inside Apple really expect their changes to satisfy EU-based regulators? Do they think this will just go away? Nobody seems to think Apple is being smart right now. Usually you can find at least some supporters from their fan base, but not this time.
- rosndo 5y ago
  > I was listening to the ATP podcast. All three hosts are big fans of Apple, they use and promote Apple products, and make all or some of their living selling apps. They all think Apple is making a huge mistake here. Hmmm…
  - criddell 5y ago
    There’s more than one way to interpret that. As people who have made significant investments in the platform, they want it to stay strong and fear that Apple’s inflexibility will ultimately hurt the platform. They are thinking about years into the future rather than the next quarter or two. They were fans of Apple before they ever started building in the ecosystem.

Guest42 5y ago

Agreed. It seems as though they've adopted a never-surrender mindset and will continue down the current path regardless of circumstances.

Nextgrid 5y ago
I think this is going to be a wake-up call, not just for Apple but big tech in general. They're used to the US where regulators, when they even exist, can trivially be worked around with lobbying or a half-assed, bad-faith "solution" like this one. It seems like this kind of strategy no longer works in the EU.
- realusername 5y ago
  They dig their own grave, they have way too much market power while simultaneously reducing as much as they can the taxes they provide in the EU, their contempt is the cherry on top. I don't even see anything which could make them not get hammered.
  - chasil 5y ago
    There should be an F-Droid for Apple, that only accepts contributions in the form of source code. Both Apple and Google should be compelled to admit anything from F-Droid into their relevant app stores, at whatever price the developer sets. When an app developer is proscribed, this option will allow access to mobile platforms that Apple or Google would otherwise revoke and ban. There is enough attention on this issue now to force this to happen. https://nypost.com/2022/01/31/googles-online-ad-business-would-be-dismantled-under-bill-gaining-bipartisan-support/ https://nypost.com/2022/01/31/googles-online-ad-business-wou...
toyg 5y ago
I reckon Cook has accepted that the party will end soon; and so they will milk the market for as much as they can, until the very last day. That's the only explanation that respects his intelligence.

Nextgrid 5y ago

This is typical "big tech" that is used to getting away with anything with the worst-case scenario being a slap on the wrist, way after the damage was caused and money was earned - very common in the US. It seems like EU regulators are starting to wake up (both this and the recent GDPR developments) and are able to see straight through the bullshit and recognize bad-faith behavior.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
arlcode 5y ago
In Europe, big tech pays very little taxes, provides very few jobs and exfiltrates mountains of personal data to foreign intelligence services. It's politically very easy to bring out the big guns here for European politicians. At least the US government can be brought to the negotiation table if it turns out to be a problem.
- Nextgrid 5y ago
  > It's politically very easy to bring out the big guns here for European politicians. If this results in a more competitive environment where we're less stalked & screwed by big tech then why not? The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

criddell 5y ago

I really don’t understand their strategy here. I was listening to the ATP podcast. All three hosts are big fans of Apple, they use and promote Apple products, and make all or some of their living selling apps. They all think Apple is making a huge mistake here. Is there anybody who thinks Apple’s recent moves are going to be good for them long term? When even your biggest fans think you are being petulant and foolish, maybe it’s time to reevaluate?

Nextgrid 5y ago
> When even your biggest fans think you are being petulant and foolish, maybe it’s time to reevaluate? Has there ever been a situation where a public company has valued consumer trust or goodwill? To me it seems like it only matters when consumers actually have a choice and you need to convince them to give you money - once you've locked them in (because of contracts or anti-competitive practices), it doesn't really matter and you can (and should) milk them out of every dollar until you can't (as in competition or regulation disrupts the status-quo).
- criddell 5y ago
  Apple’s fight right now is with regulators. You might get away with screwing consumers when your competitors are as bad or worse than you, but governments are a different thing all together. Did the lawyers inside Apple really expect their changes to satisfy EU-based regulators? Do they think this will just go away? Nobody seems to think Apple is being smart right now. Usually you can find at least some supporters from their fan base, but not this time.
rosndo 5y ago
> I was listening to the ATP podcast. All three hosts are big fans of Apple, they use and promote Apple products, and make all or some of their living selling apps. They all think Apple is making a huge mistake here. Hmmm…
- criddell 5y ago
  There’s more than one way to interpret that. As people who have made significant investments in the platform, they want it to stay strong and fear that Apple’s inflexibility will ultimately hurt the platform. They are thinking about years into the future rather than the next quarter or two. They were fans of Apple before they ever started building in the ecosystem.