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One of Cloudflare's strengths is taking dev issues really seriously. Couple weeks ago we had a post here about Cloudflare Images having lots of issues [1]. The

One of Cloudflare's strengths is taking dev issues really seriously. Couple weeks ago we had a post here about Cloudflare Images having lots of issues [1]. The post did outline a lot of valid issues. Someone from the team commented that they had forwarded the post to product manager and engineering lead for Cloudflare Images [2]. Issue 6 (Direct Creator Upload) on the list has been fixed, and the docs updated 1. https://blog.klungo.no/2021/12/07/cloudflare-images-has-a-lot-of-issues/ https://blog.klungo.no/2021/12/07/cloudflare-images-has-a-lo... 2. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29474943 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29474943

polote 5y ago
I'm not saying what you say is wrong, but I don't think an article exposing Cloudflare issues with 500 votes, is a good example to understand how Cloudflare handle feedback. Again not saying this is not the general case
- pornel 5y ago
  I'm on the Images team. We've seen the feedback post even before it hit the HN front page. We do listen to the feedback, and release improvements as fast as we can. We were able to fix some of these issues immediately. Some took more time due to deeper back-end work required, or design of alternative APIs which we've piloted with some customers. There is of course more in the pipeline. We're aware that the file size limit is still very low. It's tied to the pricing model, and we don't want to overpromise. We're internally debating how to price the product it in a way that is simple to understand, and still makes sense for different image sizes and usage patterns. It's a surprisingly tough problem. Many "why don't you just…" pricing models don't work for some usages, or create perverse incentives, or are difficult for customers to estimate how much they'll pay.
  - jrochkind1 5y ago
    The item posted to HN, linked above, begins: > but after some months in production, and a severe lack of any meaningful reply from the CF Images team addressing any of these concerns that's the concern, that the feedback didn't reach the right ears, or trigger actions, until the HN post, when it should have been possible to use normal customer relations channels and get some kind of meaningful reply. Still, yes, this is a common dilemma these days with many vendors, and that the HN post worked is also better than some!
  - ignoramous 5y ago
    > Many "why don't you just..." pricing models don't work for some usages, or create perverse incentives I think back to the story of how Amazon Prime came to be and the intense debate within Amazon leadership whether it would kill the company when logistics was their largest cost center... After they launched anyway (they had to, there's no winning the argument when Bezos believes in something with a conviction of a thousand suns), they found that not only Prime had help establish a moat around the business, but instead drove down the cost of logistics (more warehouses, more delivery vans, own airports/jets) as purchases not only rose but became predictable. The perverse incentives they were worried about were far and few in between, contrary to what they had projected. I see a similar model at Cloudflare in their steely determination to build a moat around their customers with free ingress and egress. > ...or are difficult for customers to estimate how much they'll pay. Rate limiter prices need an update. More expensive than Workers when majority of the requests are good requests!
carom 5y ago
I'm in that thread canceled my subscription to images this month. Will revisit when the original image is retrievable. Going to build off of GCP cloud storage for now.
- EatonZ 5y ago
  They added an "Export" button a while ago, so you can now download the original image.
  - carom 5y ago
    Ah, you are correct! https://api.cloudflare.com/#cloudflare-images-base-image https://api.cloudflare.com/#cloudflare-images-base-image
r1ch 5y ago
Agreed, and I hope they don't lose too much of that as they continue to grow. My personal experience - I found an issue with a certain DNS query type returning incorrect results and opened a ticket. The first reply was a confirmation of the bug with dig output and then passing it on to the DNS team who fixed it in a matter of days. At most other companies you'd need a personal contact to get that kind of response.
m348e912 5y ago
It's a little sad that it takes a HN post to get the right visibility for these issues to get resolved. Maybe they need a better issue reporting tool.

polote 5y ago

I'm not saying what you say is wrong, but I don't think an article exposing Cloudflare issues with 500 votes, is a good example to understand how Cloudflare handle feedback. Again not saying this is not the general case

pornel 5y ago
I'm on the Images team. We've seen the feedback post even before it hit the HN front page. We do listen to the feedback, and release improvements as fast as we can. We were able to fix some of these issues immediately. Some took more time due to deeper back-end work required, or design of alternative APIs which we've piloted with some customers. There is of course more in the pipeline. We're aware that the file size limit is still very low. It's tied to the pricing model, and we don't want to overpromise. We're internally debating how to price the product it in a way that is simple to understand, and still makes sense for different image sizes and usage patterns. It's a surprisingly tough problem. Many "why don't you just…" pricing models don't work for some usages, or create perverse incentives, or are difficult for customers to estimate how much they'll pay.
- jrochkind1 5y ago
  The item posted to HN, linked above, begins: > but after some months in production, and a severe lack of any meaningful reply from the CF Images team addressing any of these concerns that's the concern, that the feedback didn't reach the right ears, or trigger actions, until the HN post, when it should have been possible to use normal customer relations channels and get some kind of meaningful reply. Still, yes, this is a common dilemma these days with many vendors, and that the HN post worked is also better than some!
- ignoramous 5y ago
  > Many "why don't you just..." pricing models don't work for some usages, or create perverse incentives I think back to the story of how Amazon Prime came to be and the intense debate within Amazon leadership whether it would kill the company when logistics was their largest cost center... After they launched anyway (they had to, there's no winning the argument when Bezos believes in something with a conviction of a thousand suns), they found that not only Prime had help establish a moat around the business, but instead drove down the cost of logistics (more warehouses, more delivery vans, own airports/jets) as purchases not only rose but became predictable. The perverse incentives they were worried about were far and few in between, contrary to what they had projected. I see a similar model at Cloudflare in their steely determination to build a moat around their customers with free ingress and egress. > ...or are difficult for customers to estimate how much they'll pay. Rate limiter prices need an update. More expensive than Workers when majority of the requests are good requests!

carom 5y ago

I'm in that thread canceled my subscription to images this month. Will revisit when the original image is retrievable. Going to build off of GCP cloud storage for now.

EatonZ 5y ago
They added an "Export" button a while ago, so you can now download the original image.
- carom 5y ago
  Ah, you are correct! https://api.cloudflare.com/#cloudflare-images-base-image https://api.cloudflare.com/#cloudflare-images-base-image

r1ch 5y ago

Agreed, and I hope they don't lose too much of that as they continue to grow. My personal experience - I found an issue with a certain DNS query type returning incorrect results and opened a ticket. The first reply was a confirmation of the bug with dig output and then passing it on to the DNS team who fixed it in a matter of days. At most other companies you'd need a personal contact to get that kind of response.

m348e912 5y ago

It's a little sad that it takes a HN post to get the right visibility for these issues to get resolved. Maybe they need a better issue reporting tool.