3 ms·

I would like something explained to me. When webapp logic happens on the client side, that results in slow applications (n.b. for normal users on low-end hardw

I would like something explained to me. When webapp logic happens on the client side, that results in slow applications (n.b. for normal users on low-end hardware, not developers on high-end hardware) due to CPU costs. When webapp logic happens on the server side, that results in slow applications (n.b. for users on unreliable residential, mobile cellular, or rural connections, not those living with fiber) due to network latency. Doesn't Liveview (and related techs) simply make the slowness a stronger function of internet quality (as opposed to available processing power), instead of actually making the application less dependent on either of those factors for performance?

austincheney 5y ago
> When webapp logic happens on the client side, that results in slow applications (n.b. for normal users on low-end hardware, not developers on high-end hardware) due to CPU costs. Its not CPU. Its bad software written by people who are poorly trained and have no leadership. Do you really need 10mb of JavaScript and 10 seconds of load time to dynamically put a few lines of text on the screen? Yes, absolutely you do, because people don't know how to do it efficiently. This is a people problem, and not a technology problem. Hardware does not solve that problem. The actual technology is actually insane fast. As a counterpoint my personal app loads an OS GUI with state restoration using 2mb of JS code (unminified) in about 150ms.
- threeseed 5y ago
  > because people don't know how to do it efficiently Of course we do. We just choose not to bother because delivering features efficiently is often more valuable than shaving off a few seconds of download time. Especially when it's typically once off and then cached.
  - austincheney 5y ago
    > Of course we do. Apparently not. A few seconds is a really big deal, but that is just download time while you are also clearly not accounting for execution time. Caching code will not save on execution time.
    - threeseed 5y ago
      There are always edge cases e.g. running Amazon. But in most cases execution time is negligible and a few seconds isn't a big deal compared to having more features.
      - austincheney 5y ago
        If it takes seconds to execute more features you are doing it extremely wrong.
di4na 5y ago
No because network latency is not that big on unreliable connections if the exchange are "small" and relatively "rare". Which is most applications on the web, particularly with these techniques.

austincheney 5y ago

> When webapp logic happens on the client side, that results in slow applications (n.b. for normal users on low-end hardware, not developers on high-end hardware) due to CPU costs. Its not CPU. Its bad software written by people who are poorly trained and have no leadership. Do you really need 10mb of JavaScript and 10 seconds of load time to dynamically put a few lines of text on the screen? Yes, absolutely you do, because people don't know how to do it efficiently. This is a people problem, and not a technology problem. Hardware does not solve that problem. The actual technology is actually insane fast. As a counterpoint my personal app loads an OS GUI with state restoration using 2mb of JS code (unminified) in about 150ms.

threeseed 5y ago
> because people don't know how to do it efficiently Of course we do. We just choose not to bother because delivering features efficiently is often more valuable than shaving off a few seconds of download time. Especially when it's typically once off and then cached.
- austincheney 5y ago
  > Of course we do. Apparently not. A few seconds is a really big deal, but that is just download time while you are also clearly not accounting for execution time. Caching code will not save on execution time.
  - threeseed 5y ago
    There are always edge cases e.g. running Amazon. But in most cases execution time is negligible and a few seconds isn't a big deal compared to having more features.
    - austincheney 5y ago
      If it takes seconds to execute more features you are doing it extremely wrong.

di4na 5y ago

No because network latency is not that big on unreliable connections if the exchange are "small" and relatively "rare". Which is most applications on the web, particularly with these techniques.