3 ms·

> We hope this starts an industry trend for others to also provide these sorts of proactive warnings in their products. I guess they're hoping Tile (or whoever

> We hope this starts an industry trend for others to also provide these sorts of proactive warnings in their products. I guess they're hoping Tile (or whoever else) will feel obligated to create similar nerfs or annoyances on their trackers? I thought this was interesting because this is one time vertical integration (having a huge network of iPhones) is putting an Apple product at a competitive disadvantage

eternityforest 5y ago
This kind of scares me. Privacy first tech groups seem to be getting more vocal about trying to change the whole industry. I hope someday we have a fully open global tracking network, not affected by Apple an Mozilla and all the rest who seem to want to destroy any technology that can be used to invade privacy, regardless of how many legitimate uses it has.
- olliej 5y ago
  Can you give examples?
  - eternityforest 5y ago
    Battery Status API, Ambient Light are the two big Mozilla examples I know, but I suspect the list may be fairly long. I believe they are also against web bluetooth and serial. Apple has some permission stuff that apparently degrades Tile on their platforms IIRC.
    - olliej 5y ago
      There is no reason for any of those to be exposed to the web. For web specs you can't just think "I could do this cool thing", you have to say "what can a random popup ad do with this". Our experience with WebGL shows permission dialogs are a bad experience, and people will also click "yes" to make them go away. Most users report "would you like notifications" from websites as being spam/annoying.
      - eternityforest 5y ago
        When the only consequence is being tracked, it's mostly fine if people just click yes. It's generally common knowledge that all sites are tracking you in all ways that they can and any time they ask for a permission it's to spy on you. Users who actually are more concerned with privacy probably will not click every random button. Which is in itself one bit of trackable information, but that's about it. Battery status is very useful for kiosk applications. Web Bluetooth is obviously great for all kinds of IoT things. The more dangerous ones like Bluetooth can require you to explicitly select a target, and most people will notice something is wrong if they see MyBonerBest.io wants to connect to a list that includes their watch and light bulbs. EU Cookie consent is somewhat changing that all, by training people to click yes on prompts faster than their eyes could even focus on them. If there is a risk, it's probably more that people click out of reflex than out of not understanding, which can be partly mitigated with improved UI.
- vineyardmike 5y ago
  I really thought that Tile would release some sort of fixed LoRa type antennae in popular areas (SF, LA, NYC) managed by them that would act as supplements to their app tracking which they knew was mediocre. I've never been able to successfully use Tile's tracking, and AirTags work great. I think the Amazon Sidewalk has a lot of potential in this space as a viable alternative to the iDevice network apple has. Google should def release competition that can leverage their device network too, considering their comparable hardware penetration.

eternityforest 5y ago

This kind of scares me. Privacy first tech groups seem to be getting more vocal about trying to change the whole industry. I hope someday we have a fully open global tracking network, not affected by Apple an Mozilla and all the rest who seem to want to destroy any technology that can be used to invade privacy, regardless of how many legitimate uses it has.

olliej 5y ago
Can you give examples?
- eternityforest 5y ago
  Battery Status API, Ambient Light are the two big Mozilla examples I know, but I suspect the list may be fairly long. I believe they are also against web bluetooth and serial. Apple has some permission stuff that apparently degrades Tile on their platforms IIRC.
  - olliej 5y ago
    There is no reason for any of those to be exposed to the web. For web specs you can't just think "I could do this cool thing", you have to say "what can a random popup ad do with this". Our experience with WebGL shows permission dialogs are a bad experience, and people will also click "yes" to make them go away. Most users report "would you like notifications" from websites as being spam/annoying.
    - eternityforest 5y ago
      When the only consequence is being tracked, it's mostly fine if people just click yes. It's generally common knowledge that all sites are tracking you in all ways that they can and any time they ask for a permission it's to spy on you. Users who actually are more concerned with privacy probably will not click every random button. Which is in itself one bit of trackable information, but that's about it. Battery status is very useful for kiosk applications. Web Bluetooth is obviously great for all kinds of IoT things. The more dangerous ones like Bluetooth can require you to explicitly select a target, and most people will notice something is wrong if they see MyBonerBest.io wants to connect to a list that includes their watch and light bulbs. EU Cookie consent is somewhat changing that all, by training people to click yes on prompts faster than their eyes could even focus on them. If there is a risk, it's probably more that people click out of reflex than out of not understanding, which can be partly mitigated with improved UI.
vineyardmike 5y ago
I really thought that Tile would release some sort of fixed LoRa type antennae in popular areas (SF, LA, NYC) managed by them that would act as supplements to their app tracking which they knew was mediocre. I've never been able to successfully use Tile's tracking, and AirTags work great. I think the Amazon Sidewalk has a lot of potential in this space as a viable alternative to the iDevice network apple has. Google should def release competition that can leverage their device network too, considering their comparable hardware penetration.