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> The public fallout from a Cannonball is the possibility of a car crash that hasn't happened Do you have anything to support this? This isn't an officially mo

by shkkmo 5y ago

> The public fallout from a Cannonball is the possibility of a car crash that hasn't happened Do you have anything to support this? This isn't an officially monitored sport and participants aren't going to own up to getting non a participants injured or killed. I've been spending a lot of time on highways this year and I've seen lots of near accidents caused by people driving way to fast. While some speeding doesn't automatically make you an dangerous criminal, this kind of of reckless speeding absolutely is quite dangerous, reprehensible, and should lead to criminal charges for anyone who has admitted to participating.

mindslight 5y ago
I later added the word "seemingly" because I agree, there is a strong disincentive to admit details that would tie a crash to a speed run. I personally see more near accidents caused by inattentive drivers than by speeding. Someone changing lanes without checking their mirror is dangerous even with a 10mph speed differential. It is also my understanding that while Cannonball drivers are doing 120mph+ in open stretches, they slow down when they hit traffic. You're not going to make it 3000 miles weaving between lanes with a high speed differential. I'd imagine their behavior is similar to what what I routinely see from state police, who will come up on a bunch of traffic going 110+, and then slow down / tailgate until people in the left lane pull over and let them through (there's that culture of corruption again). I also generally see much more of this than of non-police speeding, so once again it feels a bit myopic to focus on a small contingent of people flouting social norms rather than routine harmful norms.
- shkkmo 5y ago
  The most dangerous driver I saw recently was a a driver who passed me on the shoulder of a divided 4 lane freeway with a 20+ mph speed differential because they couldn't be bothered to wait for a semi in the left lane to finish passing. This is exactly the sort of antics I would expect from a significant portion of drivers who are trying to set time records in crossing the country. Especially since these racers use spotters and other tech specifically to know when they can get away with driving recklessly. > I also generally see much more of this than of non-police speeding, Ummm... This is a laughably false claim that leads me doubt all your other observations. I have driven all over the USA and in every single place there are more non-cop speeders than cop speeders, simply because there are far more non-cops than cops. While I do agree that there are significant problems with police corruption, that in no way excuses these cannonball racers from engaging in this activity with reckless disregard for the safety of other road users. You seem quite happy to excuse this behavior based on nothing more than your assumptions about how cautions people trying to set competive records are without any evidence to back up those assumptions.
  - mindslight 5y ago
    > driver who passed me on the shoulder ... with a 20+ mph speed differential ... is exactly the sort of antics I would expect from a significant portion of drivers who are trying to set time records in crossing the country Your guess is as a good as mine. I would expect that for a 2800 mile journey, the priority is avoiding interruptions - eg crashes or getting pulled over because you've attracted determined police attention from other motorists calling you in. Reading about it, the whole thing seems like a game of coordinated logistics rather than extreme piloting. > every single place there are more non-cop speeders than cop speeders, simply because there are far more non-cops than cops. I'm sure we're defining speeding differently. On a road with average traffic of 75mph, I would only consider significantly over 80mph to be speeding in its own right. I see very few non-cops doing these speeds, whereas every moving state cop I see is cruising at 110mph+ or tailgating waiting to pass. You can tell based on how quickly they close distance from way behind you to passing you. > You seem quite happy to excuse this behavior It's literally the only way to have an interesting conversation about it. If cannonball run attempts become common enough where they create a statistical danger, then I'll be concerned about it. Until then, I'll stay concerned with the mundane-and-bad rather than getting worked up about the exceptional.
klyrs 5y ago
Indeed, nobody announces that they're setting out to do a cannonball run. This is a classical case of survivorship bias.
- quartesixte 5y ago
  Well, they do. Modern cannonball as far as I understand it to be is a team sport. You have spotters, decoys (they speed past speed traps ahead of you to occupy the only cop in the area), even helpers at the fuel stops to help you fuel. This all has to be coordinated ahead of time. I think the runs are also planned out so you don’t go through areas of high traffic. 150+ on an empty desert road is relatively safe.
  - klyrs 5y ago
    Even still, if somebody dies, the whole team is legally a conspiracy. Not the kind of thing you want to talk about in public.

by shkkmo 5y ago

mindslight 5y ago

I later added the word "seemingly" because I agree, there is a strong disincentive to admit details that would tie a crash to a speed run. I personally see more near accidents caused by inattentive drivers than by speeding. Someone changing lanes without checking their mirror is dangerous even with a 10mph speed differential. It is also my understanding that while Cannonball drivers are doing 120mph+ in open stretches, they slow down when they hit traffic. You're not going to make it 3000 miles weaving between lanes with a high speed differential. I'd imagine their behavior is similar to what what I routinely see from state police, who will come up on a bunch of traffic going 110+, and then slow down / tailgate until people in the left lane pull over and let them through (there's that culture of corruption again). I also generally see much more of this than of non-police speeding, so once again it feels a bit myopic to focus on a small contingent of people flouting social norms rather than routine harmful norms.

shkkmo 5y ago
The most dangerous driver I saw recently was a a driver who passed me on the shoulder of a divided 4 lane freeway with a 20+ mph speed differential because they couldn't be bothered to wait for a semi in the left lane to finish passing. This is exactly the sort of antics I would expect from a significant portion of drivers who are trying to set time records in crossing the country. Especially since these racers use spotters and other tech specifically to know when they can get away with driving recklessly. > I also generally see much more of this than of non-police speeding, Ummm... This is a laughably false claim that leads me doubt all your other observations. I have driven all over the USA and in every single place there are more non-cop speeders than cop speeders, simply because there are far more non-cops than cops. While I do agree that there are significant problems with police corruption, that in no way excuses these cannonball racers from engaging in this activity with reckless disregard for the safety of other road users. You seem quite happy to excuse this behavior based on nothing more than your assumptions about how cautions people trying to set competive records are without any evidence to back up those assumptions.
- mindslight 5y ago
  > driver who passed me on the shoulder ... with a 20+ mph speed differential ... is exactly the sort of antics I would expect from a significant portion of drivers who are trying to set time records in crossing the country Your guess is as a good as mine. I would expect that for a 2800 mile journey, the priority is avoiding interruptions - eg crashes or getting pulled over because you've attracted determined police attention from other motorists calling you in. Reading about it, the whole thing seems like a game of coordinated logistics rather than extreme piloting. > every single place there are more non-cop speeders than cop speeders, simply because there are far more non-cops than cops. I'm sure we're defining speeding differently. On a road with average traffic of 75mph, I would only consider significantly over 80mph to be speeding in its own right. I see very few non-cops doing these speeds, whereas every moving state cop I see is cruising at 110mph+ or tailgating waiting to pass. You can tell based on how quickly they close distance from way behind you to passing you. > You seem quite happy to excuse this behavior It's literally the only way to have an interesting conversation about it. If cannonball run attempts become common enough where they create a statistical danger, then I'll be concerned about it. Until then, I'll stay concerned with the mundane-and-bad rather than getting worked up about the exceptional.

klyrs 5y ago

Indeed, nobody announces that they're setting out to do a cannonball run. This is a classical case of survivorship bias.

quartesixte 5y ago
Well, they do. Modern cannonball as far as I understand it to be is a team sport. You have spotters, decoys (they speed past speed traps ahead of you to occupy the only cop in the area), even helpers at the fuel stops to help you fuel. This all has to be coordinated ahead of time. I think the runs are also planned out so you don’t go through areas of high traffic. 150+ on an empty desert road is relatively safe.
- klyrs 5y ago
  Even still, if somebody dies, the whole team is legally a conspiracy. Not the kind of thing you want to talk about in public.