4 ms·

> any data what-so-ever sent to a 3rd party without my knowledge or consent is too much So do you want “we want to load JS from a CDN like literally everyone d

by mwint 5y ago

> any data what-so-ever sent to a 3rd party without my knowledge or consent is too much So do you want “we want to load JS from a CDN like literally everyone does, is that okay” popups on every website?

scoutt 5y ago
As long as Personal Data isn't being trasferred, there is no need to ask.
- mwint 5y ago
  That CDN will know your IP and what site you’re from, and likely can do a decent job correlating visits with other sites. The internet is just not designed for privacy at a technical level.
  - eps 5y ago
    > The internet is just not designed for privacy at a technical level. The Internet is A-Ok. The issue lies with various slimy companies that exploit web developers ignorance, laziness and negligence with free and easy shortcuts in exchange for the private data of said developers' clients. No one's forcing you to use CDNs in place of a properly setup caching. No one's stuffing Google Fonts down your designer's throat, they are just lazy to add local resources. An analytics service is not required and there are simple self-hosted options. And so on and so forth. And the most infuriating part is that these companies, Google being the offender, know perfectly well that they are exploiting the ignorance and they are willingly facilitating and encouraging the spread of practices that would've been viewed as wildly unethical not 10-15 years ago. Just look at the level of general erosion of privacy and nearly universal lack of concern for it in general population. If you reflect on it for a moment, it is plain fucking scary.
denton-scratch 5y ago
> we want to load JS from a CDN like literally everyone does Well, carry on and load it, it's your server. Oh, wait, you mean you want ME to load it, into MY browser? That's a problem - my browser only loads JS from the origin server, and only if I give it explicit permission. As a developer, I deplore the use of CDNs to serve javascript libraries; you don't know what the CDN is going to serve to your users, it could change without warning and break your site.
- mwint 5y ago
  You’re just illustrating why this isn’t an issue requiring legislation - anyone can block requests to whatever origin they like. No need for heavy handed gov’t getting involved in technical matters.
  - Griffinsauce 5y ago
    Anyone is a huge stretch. First people need awareness and secondly skill. Neither is widespread. Leaving users, especially vulnerable ones, to the whims of businesses. Privacy isn't a "technical matter".
    - mwint 5y ago
      If the large news outlets took a couple days to educate people, they’d know how. It’s not that complicated.
      - isbvhodnvemrwvn 5y ago
        If you buy a gun then you can shoot the guy who robs you, so the robber doesn't do anything wrong.
        mwint 5y ago
        More analogous to locking your window, so the robber can’t get in to do wrong.
        germanier 5y ago
        Why is breaking into peoples' homes illegal (and prosecuted) even though anyone has the ability to lock their window?
        denton-scratch 5y ago
        Maybe because the two crimes here are (1) breaking and entering (you have to actually break something) and (2) theft. If the window isn't locked, then you don't have to break in; you can just open the window. It's not against the law to just walk in; or rather, it's the civil offence of trespass - you can sue the trespasser for damages, e.g. causing wear on your expensive carpet (but you'd have to produce evidence of monetary damages). And you can physically remove them, perhaps with the help of a bailiff. But the police won't help with common trespass - it's not a crime. [Edit] At least, that's how I understand the law here. IANAL.
youngtaff 5y ago
You should self-host 3rd-party libraries for performance and reliability reasons anyway - reduces the number of TCP connections - reduced the risk of failure if the relevant edge node can't be reached Browsers don't support cross-site caching of 3rd-party content so whatever limited benefits there might have been of using a library CDN are long gone
- toqy 5y ago
  A CDN isn't about caching jquery and sharing for various domains, everybody knows that doesn't work anymore. It's about getting jquery physically closer to your users. And sure upload it to your "own" CDN that you pay Azure or whoever for.
  - youngtaff 5y ago
    > Everybody knows this doesn't work anymore I be willing to bet that most web developers don't know about how the browser cache is partitioned And most people don't know that it never really worked (apart from perhaps a few Google fonts)

by mwint 5y ago

scoutt 5y ago

As long as Personal Data isn't being trasferred, there is no need to ask.

mwint 5y ago
That CDN will know your IP and what site you’re from, and likely can do a decent job correlating visits with other sites. The internet is just not designed for privacy at a technical level.
- eps 5y ago
  > The internet is just not designed for privacy at a technical level. The Internet is A-Ok. The issue lies with various slimy companies that exploit web developers ignorance, laziness and negligence with free and easy shortcuts in exchange for the private data of said developers' clients. No one's forcing you to use CDNs in place of a properly setup caching. No one's stuffing Google Fonts down your designer's throat, they are just lazy to add local resources. An analytics service is not required and there are simple self-hosted options. And so on and so forth. And the most infuriating part is that these companies, Google being the offender, know perfectly well that they are exploiting the ignorance and they are willingly facilitating and encouraging the spread of practices that would've been viewed as wildly unethical not 10-15 years ago. Just look at the level of general erosion of privacy and nearly universal lack of concern for it in general population. If you reflect on it for a moment, it is plain fucking scary.

denton-scratch 5y ago

> we want to load JS from a CDN like literally everyone does Well, carry on and load it, it's your server. Oh, wait, you mean you want ME to load it, into MY browser? That's a problem - my browser only loads JS from the origin server, and only if I give it explicit permission. As a developer, I deplore the use of CDNs to serve javascript libraries; you don't know what the CDN is going to serve to your users, it could change without warning and break your site.

mwint 5y ago
You’re just illustrating why this isn’t an issue requiring legislation - anyone can block requests to whatever origin they like. No need for heavy handed gov’t getting involved in technical matters.
- Griffinsauce 5y ago
  Anyone is a huge stretch. First people need awareness and secondly skill. Neither is widespread. Leaving users, especially vulnerable ones, to the whims of businesses. Privacy isn't a "technical matter".
  - mwint 5y ago
    If the large news outlets took a couple days to educate people, they’d know how. It’s not that complicated.
    - isbvhodnvemrwvn 5y ago
      If you buy a gun then you can shoot the guy who robs you, so the robber doesn't do anything wrong.
      - mwint 5y ago
        More analogous to locking your window, so the robber can’t get in to do wrong.
        germanier 5y ago
        Why is breaking into peoples' homes illegal (and prosecuted) even though anyone has the ability to lock their window?
        denton-scratch 5y ago
        Maybe because the two crimes here are (1) breaking and entering (you have to actually break something) and (2) theft. If the window isn't locked, then you don't have to break in; you can just open the window. It's not against the law to just walk in; or rather, it's the civil offence of trespass - you can sue the trespasser for damages, e.g. causing wear on your expensive carpet (but you'd have to produce evidence of monetary damages). And you can physically remove them, perhaps with the help of a bailiff. But the police won't help with common trespass - it's not a crime. [Edit] At least, that's how I understand the law here. IANAL.

youngtaff 5y ago

You should self-host 3rd-party libraries for performance and reliability reasons anyway - reduces the number of TCP connections - reduced the risk of failure if the relevant edge node can't be reached Browsers don't support cross-site caching of 3rd-party content so whatever limited benefits there might have been of using a library CDN are long gone

toqy 5y ago
A CDN isn't about caching jquery and sharing for various domains, everybody knows that doesn't work anymore. It's about getting jquery physically closer to your users. And sure upload it to your "own" CDN that you pay Azure or whoever for.
- youngtaff 5y ago
  > Everybody knows this doesn't work anymore I be willing to bet that most web developers don't know about how the browser cache is partitioned And most people don't know that it never really worked (apart from perhaps a few Google fonts)