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Possible unpopular opinion, but my wife and I want just one kid, and would greatly, greatly, prefer a daughter for reasons that include some mentioned in this a

Possible unpopular opinion, but my wife and I want just one kid, and would greatly, greatly, prefer a daughter for reasons that include some mentioned in this article. I feel a son would be so much harder to raise in today's world.

rootusrootus 5y ago
I think individual differences are far more important. I have a boy and a girl both, and my son is far, far easier to raise. I do not fear for his future, socially or economically. My daughter, on the other hand, keeps me awake at night worrying.
AlgorithmicTime 5y ago
epx 5y ago
I have a son, and am moderately optimistic this has peaked already. As the other commenter said, we see different families in very different mindsets. I have been personally affected by sexism type B: was expected to work, to be a provider someday, to pay my own way to university, if you want a car you buy it, etc. etc. My sister had the second family car at disposal and the tuition was paid for. There was this undercurrent interpretation of feminism that "women will eventually suffer so they should be pampered when possible". There were other factors at play: I have a tendency to self-indulgence, my sister does not, so it is prima facie difficult to separate what was proper, individualized upbringing and what was sexism. But sexism was a part; many male friends of the same generation have the same complaint and some could be better off today had they have more support at home. Then there is this relative of mine, that simply threw his daughters out at 18, since they are supposed to get a wealthy boyfriend and marry rich, so they don't need any further support. BTW they are disowned, too. This is sexism type A, and make it a big A. Not necessary to say this strategy did not end well: both are stuck with less-than-optimal partners and careers. We are in 2022 and a nice, wealthy and rational guy won't commit to someone without a career and finances in order.
- bradlys 5y ago
  > We are in 2022 and a nice, wealthy and rational guy won't commit to someone without a career and finances in order. This is more often false than true. I know many men who have or are marrying women who make 1/2 or less what they do. Nice, wealthy, and rational folks. They however need a woman. And there is a strong lack of women who are anywhere near where many men are in compensation and wealth. I am example of that. I married someone who made nothing. I put her through a prestigious college in the most expensive location in the country and paid for it all. Etc. Supply+demand. We got way more men than we do women in this world under age 35. As a guy - you have to settle.
  - decafninja 5y ago
    Again - unpopular opinion - but I've noticed men tend think of a potential wife's wealth or earning potential much less than vice a versa. Even when choosing a career, men seem to place a lot of importance on compensation, while women seem to place just as much, if not more, importance on other non-financial factors too. I am also an example. I make much more than my wife, and it made zero impact on my decision to date and marry her. In general I rarely see couples where the wife earns significantly more than the husband. Generally the husband makes more, they both make about even, or the wife might make slightly more.
    - bradlys 5y ago
      > Again - unpopular opinion - but I've noticed men tend think of a potential wife's wealth or earning potential much less than vice a versa. My personal experience and from what I've learned from other men: It's because most men know they won't receive a dime from their partner. It starts with how a man almost always pays for the dates or at best they split it. (Or they have a rule like - "whoever asks X out has to pay" which is of course always the man because almost no women ask any men out) Similarly - the wife is usually the SAHP not because the man doesn't ever want to do it (I know many men who'd love to be a SAHP!) but because financially it makes little to no sense. As a man - you could try to choose a woman who makes more but that's very hard. Most women don't want to be the bread winner - why do it when they've never been the one to do it anyway? There's a level of entitlement that comes with carrying children to term as well - there's an idea that they should get to spend time with their children at home for as long as they want before they have to go back to work. (A weird mentality of, "It's work that deserves to be compensated but I also really want to do this and would do it even if I wasn't compensated and definitely don't wanna go back to work!") When it makes more financial sense - I see the men be SAHP but I've only ever met one guy in that position. One! And it's because he's broke AF and his wife makes way more money. They are the one couple I know who go against the grain on these gender roles and they're both incredibly liberal leaning people. When I think back on my own experience and that of the many men I've listened to... The gifts men received, the treats, the support, etc. it's always much less than what the men were putting out. Most men know they won't receive anything from a woman even if she has the ability to. There is a certain level of entitlement and certain patriarchal values that many women have not given up and refuse to give up for the foreseeable future. One is giving up the notion that the man provides the majority or all of the financial support. There's also a nature of feeling like a woman needs to be financially spoiled in order to feel "supported"/"loved". I don't know if this is due to consumerism but it feels closer to gender roles than that. I don't think any of this stuff is ingrained. I think it's cultural. Again - why I said I don't see this changing for generations. If people are still so adamantly doing this now and it feels like many are even more ingrained now with it - there's no hope for the next 50 years. I think people will dig in more and more men will go without reproducing. > In general I rarely see couples where the wife earns significantly more than the husband. Generally the husband makes more, they both make about even, or the wife might make slightly more. It's hard to say if that's because the men chose that or if the woman chose that - but I know many women who outright declare they won't date anyone who makes less than they do and many are hesitant to date anyone who makes even the same. I know many of these women - almost all of them are my friends. Only people I know who date someone who makes less than them are men. (Gay or straight)
zapataband1 5y ago
Seems you've put a lot of thought into this, I think whatever your kid turns out to be they're already at a huge advantage to have someone like you
stronglikedan 5y ago
> a son would be so much harder to raise in today's world Maybe, but today's world is not the world your son would grow up in. We're at the end of the cycle from the G. Michael Hopf quote below. The beginning of the cycle is once again imminent, thankfully. "Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times."
- astrange 5y ago
  This unproven quote seems like a great justification for what they call “continuing the cycle of abuse”. Or what Calvin’s dad calls “building character”.
john1633 5y ago

rootusrootus 5y ago

I think individual differences are far more important. I have a boy and a girl both, and my son is far, far easier to raise. I do not fear for his future, socially or economically. My daughter, on the other hand, keeps me awake at night worrying.

AlgorithmicTime 5y ago

epx 5y ago

I have a son, and am moderately optimistic this has peaked already. As the other commenter said, we see different families in very different mindsets. I have been personally affected by sexism type B: was expected to work, to be a provider someday, to pay my own way to university, if you want a car you buy it, etc. etc. My sister had the second family car at disposal and the tuition was paid for. There was this undercurrent interpretation of feminism that "women will eventually suffer so they should be pampered when possible". There were other factors at play: I have a tendency to self-indulgence, my sister does not, so it is prima facie difficult to separate what was proper, individualized upbringing and what was sexism. But sexism was a part; many male friends of the same generation have the same complaint and some could be better off today had they have more support at home. Then there is this relative of mine, that simply threw his daughters out at 18, since they are supposed to get a wealthy boyfriend and marry rich, so they don't need any further support. BTW they are disowned, too. This is sexism type A, and make it a big A. Not necessary to say this strategy did not end well: both are stuck with less-than-optimal partners and careers. We are in 2022 and a nice, wealthy and rational guy won't commit to someone without a career and finances in order.

bradlys 5y ago
> We are in 2022 and a nice, wealthy and rational guy won't commit to someone without a career and finances in order. This is more often false than true. I know many men who have or are marrying women who make 1/2 or less what they do. Nice, wealthy, and rational folks. They however need a woman. And there is a strong lack of women who are anywhere near where many men are in compensation and wealth. I am example of that. I married someone who made nothing. I put her through a prestigious college in the most expensive location in the country and paid for it all. Etc. Supply+demand. We got way more men than we do women in this world under age 35. As a guy - you have to settle.
- decafninja 5y ago
  Again - unpopular opinion - but I've noticed men tend think of a potential wife's wealth or earning potential much less than vice a versa. Even when choosing a career, men seem to place a lot of importance on compensation, while women seem to place just as much, if not more, importance on other non-financial factors too. I am also an example. I make much more than my wife, and it made zero impact on my decision to date and marry her. In general I rarely see couples where the wife earns significantly more than the husband. Generally the husband makes more, they both make about even, or the wife might make slightly more.
  - bradlys 5y ago
    > Again - unpopular opinion - but I've noticed men tend think of a potential wife's wealth or earning potential much less than vice a versa. My personal experience and from what I've learned from other men: It's because most men know they won't receive a dime from their partner. It starts with how a man almost always pays for the dates or at best they split it. (Or they have a rule like - "whoever asks X out has to pay" which is of course always the man because almost no women ask any men out) Similarly - the wife is usually the SAHP not because the man doesn't ever want to do it (I know many men who'd love to be a SAHP!) but because financially it makes little to no sense. As a man - you could try to choose a woman who makes more but that's very hard. Most women don't want to be the bread winner - why do it when they've never been the one to do it anyway? There's a level of entitlement that comes with carrying children to term as well - there's an idea that they should get to spend time with their children at home for as long as they want before they have to go back to work. (A weird mentality of, "It's work that deserves to be compensated but I also really want to do this and would do it even if I wasn't compensated and definitely don't wanna go back to work!") When it makes more financial sense - I see the men be SAHP but I've only ever met one guy in that position. One! And it's because he's broke AF and his wife makes way more money. They are the one couple I know who go against the grain on these gender roles and they're both incredibly liberal leaning people. When I think back on my own experience and that of the many men I've listened to... The gifts men received, the treats, the support, etc. it's always much less than what the men were putting out. Most men know they won't receive anything from a woman even if she has the ability to. There is a certain level of entitlement and certain patriarchal values that many women have not given up and refuse to give up for the foreseeable future. One is giving up the notion that the man provides the majority or all of the financial support. There's also a nature of feeling like a woman needs to be financially spoiled in order to feel "supported"/"loved". I don't know if this is due to consumerism but it feels closer to gender roles than that. I don't think any of this stuff is ingrained. I think it's cultural. Again - why I said I don't see this changing for generations. If people are still so adamantly doing this now and it feels like many are even more ingrained now with it - there's no hope for the next 50 years. I think people will dig in more and more men will go without reproducing. > In general I rarely see couples where the wife earns significantly more than the husband. Generally the husband makes more, they both make about even, or the wife might make slightly more. It's hard to say if that's because the men chose that or if the woman chose that - but I know many women who outright declare they won't date anyone who makes less than they do and many are hesitant to date anyone who makes even the same. I know many of these women - almost all of them are my friends. Only people I know who date someone who makes less than them are men. (Gay or straight)

zapataband1 5y ago

Seems you've put a lot of thought into this, I think whatever your kid turns out to be they're already at a huge advantage to have someone like you

stronglikedan 5y ago

> a son would be so much harder to raise in today's world Maybe, but today's world is not the world your son would grow up in. We're at the end of the cycle from the G. Michael Hopf quote below. The beginning of the cycle is once again imminent, thankfully. "Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times."

astrange 5y ago
This unproven quote seems like a great justification for what they call “continuing the cycle of abuse”. Or what Calvin’s dad calls “building character”.

john1633 5y ago