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How about we wait until hospitals have the capacity to resume elective surgeries. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/kitchener-waterloo/waterloo-region-elective-su

How about we wait until hospitals have the capacity to resume elective surgeries. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/kitchener-waterloo/waterloo-region-elective-surgery-delays-due-to-covid-clog-1.6339749 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/kitchener-waterloo/waterloo-r... Ontario hospitalization of people with COVID-19 peaked on January 18th, less than one month ago, at the highest level ever recorded during this pandemic. While perhaps less than half of those hospitalized are there for COVID, nevertheless, those people need to be put in isolation wards. That is, unless you believe that the second-most contagious virus known should be just allowed to course through hospital wards. Ontario COVID ICU usage peaked on January 24th at the second highest level ever seen during this pandemic. That was only two weeks ago. On Jan 31st Ontario eased their lockdown and there is great uncertainty about whether hospital and ICU admissions are going to start increasing again in the subsequent weeks because we have only a limited understanding of how many people were infected during the Omicron wave. Baring another mutation that would thrust COVID into the position of the most contagious known virus, or otherwise evade immunity, we are nearing the end of the pandemic phase, where the virus is novel to the general population, and entering an endemic phase. Hospital beds will clear, surgeries will resume and then we can resume a more normal lifestyle. However, if you are a fan of medical services, like I am, we probably need a little bit more time.

xiphias2 5y ago
Not allowing superspreading events, like football matches or huge parties, but truckers are travelling alone, I’m quite doubtful that they are the reason that the hospitals are full.
- rssoconnor 5y ago
  First of all I feel I should start by saying that the Ottawa protests are not about truckers. https://www.trucknews.com/blogs/the-so-called-freedom-convoy-was-never-about-truckers-or-border-mandates/ https://www.trucknews.com/blogs/the-so-called-freedom-convoy... The protests are disavowed by the Canadian Trucking Alliance and 90% of truckers are vaccinated and are exempt from the quarantine rules. Instead, the protest organizers are western separatists with their own agendas. This is their protest and the are using the Trucking industry as a tool in their PR. The very fact that we are discussing truckers now here on HN has more to do with their PR campaign than trucker well-being. https://cantruck.ca/statement-by-canadian-trucking-alliance-president-on-ottawa-protests/ https://cantruck.ca/statement-by-canadian-trucking-alliance-... Secondly, Canada's ending of the exemption for truckers from quarantine rules is reciprocal with the US rules. Canada unilaterally reinstating the quarantine exemption for cross-border truckers does approximately nothing to help unvaccinated cross-border truckers because they are still subject to the US rules regarding vaccination status when entering back into the United States. Again, this just goes to show that the protests in Ottawa have nothing to do with actual cross-border trucking. It would require international cooperation to actually address the alleged issue at hand. Now, with regards to the matter of whether truckers traveling alone are the cause of the hospitals being full: The Omicron variant didn't originate in Canada. The virus was imported into the country from outside through a human vessel and was only able to establish itself in the country due to a violation of quarantine. No doubt the Omicron variant entered the country multiple times through multiple carriers. Probably some of these carriers were subject to quarantine rules and violated the rules. Possibly some of these carriers were exempt from quarantine rules to begin with. But as a matter of fact, the reason the hospitals are full is because some people came into the country and didn't adequately quarantine, regardless of whether they were required to or if they were exempt. Now, I do get it. Canada is not New Zealand. Our COVID border protections are a sieve. There was no way Omicron was ever going to be kept out of Canada. But just because our border protections are a sieve, isn't reason to eliminate them. Our goal here is not to prevent COVID from existing in Canada. Our goal is to spread out when people get sick over time so the people who will require hospital services don't all require it simultaneously. And it is plausible that our sieve can help in that regards. When Omicron first enters Canada, it will spread more slowly if the "seeds" we are importing are spread out over time. The fewer seeds that are planted, and the more time in between them, both spreads out when people fall ill and gives more time to administer booster shots to the most at risk people. With that all said, Omicron is now firmly planted in Canada. Whether cross-border travelers of any kind import Omicron basically makes no difference. So, as long as COVID doesn't mutate to move from the the second most contagious virus known to the most contagious virus known or otherwise escape immunity, the border policy isn't really effective at doing anything anymore. From my armchair it seems very unlikely that COVID has room to grow more contagious. But I also felt the same thing about Delta, so WTF do I know. Therefore, I defer to those who hopefully know more than I do. If government advisors say, "hey, this COVID thing is well past its peak. Border policy is no longer doing anything meaningful. There is no longer any point in keeping it." then I'll be on board with that. If government advisors say, "so long as COVID continues to run its mutation experiments in millions of human shaped petri dishes across the globe, we will continue to keep our COVID border sieve in place." then I'm on board with that too. And if that means 10% less cross-border trucking capacity, then I'm okay with that too.
  - xiphias2 5y ago
    Omicron is great at evading antibodies (luckily the T cells are still working in my vaccinated body for serious complications), so at this point vaccination rules outside hospitals have no medical value (limiting superspreading events may still help, but at this point it's hard to know). I also saw the anti-governent signs, but I don't blame the people for it, although it may make the protest less effective in achieving something on the short term. I have seen far right protests before, and this just doesn't look like that, even if it was initiated by a far right group.

xiphias2 5y ago

Not allowing superspreading events, like football matches or huge parties, but truckers are travelling alone, I’m quite doubtful that they are the reason that the hospitals are full.

rssoconnor 5y ago
First of all I feel I should start by saying that the Ottawa protests are not about truckers. https://www.trucknews.com/blogs/the-so-called-freedom-convoy-was-never-about-truckers-or-border-mandates/ https://www.trucknews.com/blogs/the-so-called-freedom-convoy... The protests are disavowed by the Canadian Trucking Alliance and 90% of truckers are vaccinated and are exempt from the quarantine rules. Instead, the protest organizers are western separatists with their own agendas. This is their protest and the are using the Trucking industry as a tool in their PR. The very fact that we are discussing truckers now here on HN has more to do with their PR campaign than trucker well-being. https://cantruck.ca/statement-by-canadian-trucking-alliance-president-on-ottawa-protests/ https://cantruck.ca/statement-by-canadian-trucking-alliance-... Secondly, Canada's ending of the exemption for truckers from quarantine rules is reciprocal with the US rules. Canada unilaterally reinstating the quarantine exemption for cross-border truckers does approximately nothing to help unvaccinated cross-border truckers because they are still subject to the US rules regarding vaccination status when entering back into the United States. Again, this just goes to show that the protests in Ottawa have nothing to do with actual cross-border trucking. It would require international cooperation to actually address the alleged issue at hand. Now, with regards to the matter of whether truckers traveling alone are the cause of the hospitals being full: The Omicron variant didn't originate in Canada. The virus was imported into the country from outside through a human vessel and was only able to establish itself in the country due to a violation of quarantine. No doubt the Omicron variant entered the country multiple times through multiple carriers. Probably some of these carriers were subject to quarantine rules and violated the rules. Possibly some of these carriers were exempt from quarantine rules to begin with. But as a matter of fact, the reason the hospitals are full is because some people came into the country and didn't adequately quarantine, regardless of whether they were required to or if they were exempt. Now, I do get it. Canada is not New Zealand. Our COVID border protections are a sieve. There was no way Omicron was ever going to be kept out of Canada. But just because our border protections are a sieve, isn't reason to eliminate them. Our goal here is not to prevent COVID from existing in Canada. Our goal is to spread out when people get sick over time so the people who will require hospital services don't all require it simultaneously. And it is plausible that our sieve can help in that regards. When Omicron first enters Canada, it will spread more slowly if the "seeds" we are importing are spread out over time. The fewer seeds that are planted, and the more time in between them, both spreads out when people fall ill and gives more time to administer booster shots to the most at risk people. With that all said, Omicron is now firmly planted in Canada. Whether cross-border travelers of any kind import Omicron basically makes no difference. So, as long as COVID doesn't mutate to move from the the second most contagious virus known to the most contagious virus known or otherwise escape immunity, the border policy isn't really effective at doing anything anymore. From my armchair it seems very unlikely that COVID has room to grow more contagious. But I also felt the same thing about Delta, so WTF do I know. Therefore, I defer to those who hopefully know more than I do. If government advisors say, "hey, this COVID thing is well past its peak. Border policy is no longer doing anything meaningful. There is no longer any point in keeping it." then I'll be on board with that. If government advisors say, "so long as COVID continues to run its mutation experiments in millions of human shaped petri dishes across the globe, we will continue to keep our COVID border sieve in place." then I'm on board with that too. And if that means 10% less cross-border trucking capacity, then I'm okay with that too.
- xiphias2 5y ago
  Omicron is great at evading antibodies (luckily the T cells are still working in my vaccinated body for serious complications), so at this point vaccination rules outside hospitals have no medical value (limiting superspreading events may still help, but at this point it's hard to know). I also saw the anti-governent signs, but I don't blame the people for it, although it may make the protest less effective in achieving something on the short term. I have seen far right protests before, and this just doesn't look like that, even if it was initiated by a far right group.