4 ms·

Exactly. It's the most secure and reliable accounting system imaginable. Anyone who believes that this degree of reliability and security is not required is na

Exactly. It's the most secure and reliable accounting system imaginable. Anyone who believes that this degree of reliability and security is not required is naive and doesn't understand human nature and doesn't understand how capitalism shapes human nature. This kind of accounting system is absolutely essential. History shows over and over that the means of power can be corrupted will be corrupted. If you haven't figured this out by now, you haven't been paying attention... You don't even need to look at history to see this. Just open your eyes to what's happening right now.

simonh 5y ago
I match your accusation of misunderstanding human nature, and raise it an accusation of profound naivety. If blockchains actually start being used for economically or socially productive or valuable functions then they will be regulated. Suppose you sell something and the transaction is logged on a blockchain, that's immutable right? It's right there in the ledger, nothing anyone can do about it. It's immune from governmental interference right? Say a court invalidates the transaction, maybe they think you lied to the counter-party, nothing they can do, right? The blockchain doesn't lie. Except they can prosecute you, fine you, imprison you, confiscate your property, pursue you to the ends of the earth and even kill you. If the transaction was an NFT, they can just directly modify the resource the NFT refers to. If it's bitcoin, they can fine you equivalent value in real world money and assets, or if they can be bothered to care about the bitcoin at all they can legally coerce you into transferring the bitcoin back. It's like the scene in Game of Thrones where Little Finger tells Cersei that knowledge is power and only barely survives at her pleasure because presumably she was in a good mood. No. Power is power.
- cryptica 5y ago
  But the thing is that any movement of tokens on the blockchain is public for all to see. It removes a government's ability to do things in secret. With centralized systems, shady stuff is happening all over the place. Systems get hacked all the time, funds are stolen by ex-employees without anybody noticing. It's naive to not see how corrupted and hacked the majority of modern centralized systems have become... Big companies are constantly paying off hackers to avoid DDoS attacks. All this stuff is happening silently and constantly behind the scenes. Adding a layer of transparency to money transfers can go a long way.
  - simonh 5y ago
    > It removes a government's ability to do things in secret. I don’t get it. How does you using a black chain stop a government doing things in secret? I mean, all they have to do is not use the blockchain. And anyway, isn’t the point of the blockchain supposed to be that it’s anonymous? Confused.
UncleMeat 5y ago
It is extremely secure and reliable against very specific forms of attacks and provides little to no protection against other common forms of attacks.
jqpabc123 5y ago
... naive and doesn't understand human nature and doesn't understand how capitalism shapes human nature. You do understand that the crypto "exchanges" are effectively the gatekeepers to this "most secure and reliable accounting system"? And appreciating how "capitalism shapes human nature", only a naive fool would ever expect them to do anything but promote their own interests above others. In other words, "trust" is still inherent to crypto/blockchain. Ever hear of a "rug pull"?
- cryptica 5y ago
  Anyone can move their tokens on-chain so nobody is forced to trust an exchange. Exchanges aren't gate keepers. You don't even exchanges to acquire Bitcoin; many deals are done OTC or salaries can be paid directly on-chain. Also, most whales only keep a fraction of their total holdings on the exchanges.

simonh 5y ago

I match your accusation of misunderstanding human nature, and raise it an accusation of profound naivety. If blockchains actually start being used for economically or socially productive or valuable functions then they will be regulated. Suppose you sell something and the transaction is logged on a blockchain, that's immutable right? It's right there in the ledger, nothing anyone can do about it. It's immune from governmental interference right? Say a court invalidates the transaction, maybe they think you lied to the counter-party, nothing they can do, right? The blockchain doesn't lie. Except they can prosecute you, fine you, imprison you, confiscate your property, pursue you to the ends of the earth and even kill you. If the transaction was an NFT, they can just directly modify the resource the NFT refers to. If it's bitcoin, they can fine you equivalent value in real world money and assets, or if they can be bothered to care about the bitcoin at all they can legally coerce you into transferring the bitcoin back. It's like the scene in Game of Thrones where Little Finger tells Cersei that knowledge is power and only barely survives at her pleasure because presumably she was in a good mood. No. Power is power.

cryptica 5y ago
But the thing is that any movement of tokens on the blockchain is public for all to see. It removes a government's ability to do things in secret. With centralized systems, shady stuff is happening all over the place. Systems get hacked all the time, funds are stolen by ex-employees without anybody noticing. It's naive to not see how corrupted and hacked the majority of modern centralized systems have become... Big companies are constantly paying off hackers to avoid DDoS attacks. All this stuff is happening silently and constantly behind the scenes. Adding a layer of transparency to money transfers can go a long way.
- simonh 5y ago
  > It removes a government's ability to do things in secret. I don’t get it. How does you using a black chain stop a government doing things in secret? I mean, all they have to do is not use the blockchain. And anyway, isn’t the point of the blockchain supposed to be that it’s anonymous? Confused.

UncleMeat 5y ago

It is extremely secure and reliable against very specific forms of attacks and provides little to no protection against other common forms of attacks.

jqpabc123 5y ago

... naive and doesn't understand human nature and doesn't understand how capitalism shapes human nature. You do understand that the crypto "exchanges" are effectively the gatekeepers to this "most secure and reliable accounting system"? And appreciating how "capitalism shapes human nature", only a naive fool would ever expect them to do anything but promote their own interests above others. In other words, "trust" is still inherent to crypto/blockchain. Ever hear of a "rug pull"?

cryptica 5y ago
Anyone can move their tokens on-chain so nobody is forced to trust an exchange. Exchanges aren't gate keepers. You don't even exchanges to acquire Bitcoin; many deals are done OTC or salaries can be paid directly on-chain. Also, most whales only keep a fraction of their total holdings on the exchanges.