4 ms·

> It's very impressive to see these decades-longs projects pay off, Just read recently that Moscow is now in the process of building a couple of dozens metro s

> It's very impressive to see these decades-longs projects pay off, Just read recently that Moscow is now in the process of building a couple of dozens metro stations outside of its ~60-miles long ring-road, to add to the existing ~230 stations. I wish someone would also write a more in-depth write-up of that and how do the Russians manage to do it (including how do they manage to keep the whole network running at what I assume to be reasonable costs), out in the West the knowledge of how to maintain such a system at low-ish costs and how to extend it seems to have been lost.

Tade0 5y ago
There's an interesting study showing the modal split in various cities. Moscow is particularly interesting: https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/insights/us/articles/4331_Deloitte-City-Mobility-Index/Moscow_GlobalCityMobility_WEB.pdf https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/insights/us/articles/4... The 78% share of public transport dwarves figures from any western city. Car utilization is also fairly low. I think it has something to do with scale. The city is enormous, so cycling and walking (especially in winter) is just not viable and the statistics reflect that. High ridership means more revenue, so hopefully a high percentage of costs covered by fares. I don't know about Moscow, but I grew up in Warsaw where the subway rolling stock is still in significant part the Metrovagonmash Series 81: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrovagonmash_81-717/81-714 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrovagonmash_81-717/81-714 - which serves in Moscow's lines as well. The train is fairly noisy and the design is dated, but it didn't change significantly throughout the years, so I guess a lot of money was saved on R&D.
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andrewl-hn 5y ago
I don't think metro construction projects in Moscow are particularly cheap. But building extra stations makes a lot of sense due to scale and concentration. Moscow metropolitan area represents 1/5th of Russia's GDP and 1/7th of countries population. A new station in Moscow potentially benefits a higher proportion of Russians then, say, a station in NYC for Americans. Moscow is also one of the most congested cities in the world (n.1 in 2020 https://www.tomtom.com/en_gb/traffic-index/ranking/ https://www.tomtom.com/en_gb/traffic-index/ranking/). Expanding public transport is probably the only way the city can sustain itself. Also, metro is extremely popular among the population in general. Building new stations and lines is a crowd pleaser and voters winner. AFAIK lack of widespread public support is the reason many public transportation projects fail in the US.
thriftwy 5y ago
Basically, a few years ago the Moscow mayorate asked themself a question "can we build the Metro at Chinese rate?" and found the answer to be "yes". Before that, Moscow metro had half dozen new stations per decade, now it's half dozen/yr. Saint Petersburg is still on the former schedule. But the takeway here, there's China who build a few new systems per year, go ask them and maybe employ some of their tech.

Tade0 5y ago

There's an interesting study showing the modal split in various cities. Moscow is particularly interesting: https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/insights/us/articles/4331_Deloitte-City-Mobility-Index/Moscow_GlobalCityMobility_WEB.pdf https://www2.deloitte.com/content/dam/insights/us/articles/4... The 78% share of public transport dwarves figures from any western city. Car utilization is also fairly low. I think it has something to do with scale. The city is enormous, so cycling and walking (especially in winter) is just not viable and the statistics reflect that. High ridership means more revenue, so hopefully a high percentage of costs covered by fares. I don't know about Moscow, but I grew up in Warsaw where the subway rolling stock is still in significant part the Metrovagonmash Series 81: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrovagonmash_81-717/81-714 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrovagonmash_81-717/81-714 - which serves in Moscow's lines as well. The train is fairly noisy and the design is dated, but it didn't change significantly throughout the years, so I guess a lot of money was saved on R&D.

deleted 5y ago
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andrewl-hn 5y ago

I don't think metro construction projects in Moscow are particularly cheap. But building extra stations makes a lot of sense due to scale and concentration. Moscow metropolitan area represents 1/5th of Russia's GDP and 1/7th of countries population. A new station in Moscow potentially benefits a higher proportion of Russians then, say, a station in NYC for Americans. Moscow is also one of the most congested cities in the world (n.1 in 2020 https://www.tomtom.com/en_gb/traffic-index/ranking/ https://www.tomtom.com/en_gb/traffic-index/ranking/). Expanding public transport is probably the only way the city can sustain itself. Also, metro is extremely popular among the population in general. Building new stations and lines is a crowd pleaser and voters winner. AFAIK lack of widespread public support is the reason many public transportation projects fail in the US.

thriftwy 5y ago

Basically, a few years ago the Moscow mayorate asked themself a question "can we build the Metro at Chinese rate?" and found the answer to be "yes". Before that, Moscow metro had half dozen new stations per decade, now it's half dozen/yr. Saint Petersburg is still on the former schedule. But the takeway here, there's China who build a few new systems per year, go ask them and maybe employ some of their tech.