4 ms·

> If that can happen, then that is a security flaw of the device and should be fixed, no? Yes. It should be fixed. Guess what? Nobody has ever in human hist

by zepto 5y ago

> If that can happen, then that is a security flaw of the device and should be fixed, no? Yes. It should be fixed. Guess what? Nobody has ever in human history figured out how to make software that is free of security flaws. That’s why these things are only part of the solution. > I mean, reading a text could install a virus on iPhones last year, yet I didn't see people screaming that all texts should have to go through Apple to make sure they aren't a virus If you think application software is like a text message then you don’t know enough to comment on this issue.

flutas 5y ago
> If you think application software is like a text message then you don’t know enough to comment on this issue. If you think that was an example of what I think software is like, then you probably shouldn't comment on it either. I'm just commenting on the fact that, like you said, there's always going to be security issues and using them as the scapegoat for "why" this can't happen is a bad argument. What's the difference between running an app ad-hoc right now (via XCode) vs allowing a user to download and install any app they want. The answer is, there isn't any except for artificial limitations put in place by apple. Anything an app that is installed could do would be the same between the store, ad-hoc builds, or installed from a download. The security is in the platform, not the App Store. How many times have we seen something slip through Apple's review process? Fortnite got a full CC flow UI through, many apps back in the day would slip WiFi tethering into their app and get through. All it would take is a simple API call with a boolean to enable or disable the "security issue." You could always do checks to see what API calls they are using and use that as a metric of "security" but that can also be done device-side. "Hey, this app is using a sketchy API that shouldn't be public, we're going to block it."
- zepto 5y ago
  > like you said, there's always going to be security issues and using them as the scapegoat for "why" this can't happen is a bad argument. No it isn’t. If you agree that there are always going to be security issues, then there is no reason why customers shouldn’t be able to choose a product where human moderation is used to mitigate them. You haven’t made any case as to why customers should be denied this option.
  - flutas 5y ago
    >If you agree that there are always going to be security issues, then there is no reason why customers shouldn’t be able to choose a product where human moderation is used to mitigate them. First of all, that is one of the worst arguments I've ever heard. A iMessage can install a virus, but you don't see people asking for human moderation of all of their messages on the remote chance that one message contains a virus. I'll also just copy/paste my reply here since you decided to not reply to it. What's the difference between running an app ad-hoc right now (via XCode) vs allowing a user to download and install any app they want. The answer is, there isn't any except for artificial limitations put in place by apple. Anything an app that is installed could do would be the same between the store, ad-hoc builds, or installed from a download. The security is in the platform, not the App Store. How many times have we seen something slip through Apple's review process? Fortnite got a full CC flow UI through, many apps back in the day would slip WiFi tethering into their app and get through. All it would take is a simple API call with a boolean to enable or disable the "security issue." > You haven’t made any case as to why customers should be denied this option. Xbox Game Pass, done. Any time Apple bans someone from using a new technology, it harms the consumer and limits user choice.
    - zepto 5y ago
      > A iMessage can install a virus, but you don't see people asking for human moderation of all of their messages on the remote chance that one message contains a virus. You keep making this silly silly argument. A text message is not like a software application. If you really thing the two are comparable, you honestly don’t know anything about computer technology. You also clearly don’t understand security if you think a platform can be free of security flaws. As for things slipping through app review. Obviously that happens. That proves that the platform isn’t secure, and that App review isn’t perfect. If app review wasn’t there, even more things would ‘slip through’. What matters is not how many things slip through, but how many are stopped. The platform security isn’t perfect, and nor is app review. Together they are much better than one would be alone. It isn’t hard to understand this if you want to.
      - 5y ago

by zepto 5y ago

flutas 5y ago

> If you think application software is like a text message then you don’t know enough to comment on this issue. If you think that was an example of what I think software is like, then you probably shouldn't comment on it either. I'm just commenting on the fact that, like you said, there's always going to be security issues and using them as the scapegoat for "why" this can't happen is a bad argument. What's the difference between running an app ad-hoc right now (via XCode) vs allowing a user to download and install any app they want. The answer is, there isn't any except for artificial limitations put in place by apple. Anything an app that is installed could do would be the same between the store, ad-hoc builds, or installed from a download. The security is in the platform, not the App Store. How many times have we seen something slip through Apple's review process? Fortnite got a full CC flow UI through, many apps back in the day would slip WiFi tethering into their app and get through. All it would take is a simple API call with a boolean to enable or disable the "security issue." You could always do checks to see what API calls they are using and use that as a metric of "security" but that can also be done device-side. "Hey, this app is using a sketchy API that shouldn't be public, we're going to block it."

zepto 5y ago
> like you said, there's always going to be security issues and using them as the scapegoat for "why" this can't happen is a bad argument. No it isn’t. If you agree that there are always going to be security issues, then there is no reason why customers shouldn’t be able to choose a product where human moderation is used to mitigate them. You haven’t made any case as to why customers should be denied this option.
- flutas 5y ago
  >If you agree that there are always going to be security issues, then there is no reason why customers shouldn’t be able to choose a product where human moderation is used to mitigate them. First of all, that is one of the worst arguments I've ever heard. A iMessage can install a virus, but you don't see people asking for human moderation of all of their messages on the remote chance that one message contains a virus. I'll also just copy/paste my reply here since you decided to not reply to it. What's the difference between running an app ad-hoc right now (via XCode) vs allowing a user to download and install any app they want. The answer is, there isn't any except for artificial limitations put in place by apple. Anything an app that is installed could do would be the same between the store, ad-hoc builds, or installed from a download. The security is in the platform, not the App Store. How many times have we seen something slip through Apple's review process? Fortnite got a full CC flow UI through, many apps back in the day would slip WiFi tethering into their app and get through. All it would take is a simple API call with a boolean to enable or disable the "security issue." > You haven’t made any case as to why customers should be denied this option. Xbox Game Pass, done. Any time Apple bans someone from using a new technology, it harms the consumer and limits user choice.
  - zepto 5y ago
    > A iMessage can install a virus, but you don't see people asking for human moderation of all of their messages on the remote chance that one message contains a virus. You keep making this silly silly argument. A text message is not like a software application. If you really thing the two are comparable, you honestly don’t know anything about computer technology. You also clearly don’t understand security if you think a platform can be free of security flaws. As for things slipping through app review. Obviously that happens. That proves that the platform isn’t secure, and that App review isn’t perfect. If app review wasn’t there, even more things would ‘slip through’. What matters is not how many things slip through, but how many are stopped. The platform security isn’t perfect, and nor is app review. Together they are much better than one would be alone. It isn’t hard to understand this if you want to.
    - 5y ago