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No they're not. A) there's more vaccinated in hospital per capita of late. Why aren't we demanding lockdowns again instead of just blaming the "unvaxxed" stil

No they're not. A) there's more vaccinated in hospital per capita of late. Why aren't we demanding lockdowns again instead of just blaming the "unvaxxed" still B) the unvaxxed still aren't allowed into many places, yet the virus spreads readily C) Why, rather than just "argh unvaxxed lepers!" are we not guiding better health and wellbeing instead? D) a covid case is counted when people are in hospital for any other reason and catch it E) you are counted as unvaxxed during the two week window after getting vaccinated, which is exactly when your immune system is weaker and succeptible to catching a bad case of covid. Interesting how hard it is to find this data, you'd think it would be strongly monitored

lkbm 5y ago
> A) there's more vaccinated in hospital per capita of late. Why aren't we demanding lockdowns again instead of just blaming the "unvaxxed" still Do you have a source for this. This directly conflicts the data I've been seeing. e.g.: https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page#daily https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page#daily — weekly hospitalizations peaking at 92/100k for vaccinated vs. 772/100k for unvaccinated.
- _0ffh 5y ago
  There was data from Denmark, Germany, and a third place a couple of weeks ago where the share of Omikron infections in the vaccinated was 10-15% points greater than the share in the total population (like 70% vacc/total vs 80% vacc/infected). I've checked one of the original sources (country's public health agency) and it confirmed the claim. To be fair, that could be because there are more restrictions for the unvax'd versus the vax'd.
  - aqme28 5y ago
    Share of infections is different though. We were talking about the hospitalization rate.
    - _0ffh 5y ago
      Oops, sorry for the mix-up! I can't speak to the hospitalisation numbers, but I'd be very surprised indeed if the situation there was similar.
- headsoup 5y ago
  Here's one example: https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/new-data-on-vaccine-efficacy-from https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/new-data-on-vaccine-effic...
  - aqme28 5y ago
    This is such incredibly disingenuous statistics. Of course there are more vaxxed with COVID than unvaxxed in a sample of 100,000 people. The vast majority of people are vaccinated! You're comparing two entirely different denominators. This is just sloppy. Edit: Digging through the source data, I found > In the last week from 08 January to 14 January 2022, in an age-standardised population, the rate of acute COVID-19 related hospital admissions in individuals that received a booster or third dose of a COVID-19 vaccine was between 2.3 to 3.9 times lower than in individuals who are unvaccinated or have only received one or two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine Your own data is saying the opposite of what you purport it to.
    - headsoup 5y ago
      You didn't read at all. The stats are adjusted for populations within those cohorts.
    - roenxi 5y ago
      It is an appropriate use of statistics regardless. The main thrust of headsoup's argument was that the focus on unvaxxed people isn't helpful because they aren't important in absolute terms. The rate doesn't matter so much in this instance, because most resources would still be spend on vaccinated people. Much like the fact that when I eventually catch COVID the odds are really good that I'm going to get it off someone who is vaccinated. If we hypothetically rounded up all the unvaxxed tomorrow most of the strain on the hospital system faces in Scotland would still be there. Vaccination campaigns can't really change that.
aqme28 5y ago
A) This is counter to everything I can find online. Going to need citations. B) This is true. Not sure how it relates to my point though. C) Aren't we doing both? I've seen both "get vaccinated" and "be healthy" messaging this whole pandemic. Again though, not sure how it relates. D) True. Again, not sure how this relates. E) That was a big effect when vaccines just came out, but is a much smaller effect now. Though I hadn't heard this before, and would be curious to see a study on it if you have one: "when your immune system is weaker and succeptible to catching a bad case of covid." Edit: Your thing about susceptibility after vaccination is incorrect. It's an Alex Berenson talking point that has been thoroughly debunked.

lkbm 5y ago

> A) there's more vaccinated in hospital per capita of late. Why aren't we demanding lockdowns again instead of just blaming the "unvaxxed" still Do you have a source for this. This directly conflicts the data I've been seeing. e.g.: https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page#daily https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page#daily — weekly hospitalizations peaking at 92/100k for vaccinated vs. 772/100k for unvaccinated.

_0ffh 5y ago
There was data from Denmark, Germany, and a third place a couple of weeks ago where the share of Omikron infections in the vaccinated was 10-15% points greater than the share in the total population (like 70% vacc/total vs 80% vacc/infected). I've checked one of the original sources (country's public health agency) and it confirmed the claim. To be fair, that could be because there are more restrictions for the unvax'd versus the vax'd.
- aqme28 5y ago
  Share of infections is different though. We were talking about the hospitalization rate.
  - _0ffh 5y ago
    Oops, sorry for the mix-up! I can't speak to the hospitalisation numbers, but I'd be very surprised indeed if the situation there was similar.
headsoup 5y ago
Here's one example: https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/new-data-on-vaccine-efficacy-from https://boriquagato.substack.com/p/new-data-on-vaccine-effic...
- aqme28 5y ago
  This is such incredibly disingenuous statistics. Of course there are more vaxxed with COVID than unvaxxed in a sample of 100,000 people. The vast majority of people are vaccinated! You're comparing two entirely different denominators. This is just sloppy. Edit: Digging through the source data, I found > In the last week from 08 January to 14 January 2022, in an age-standardised population, the rate of acute COVID-19 related hospital admissions in individuals that received a booster or third dose of a COVID-19 vaccine was between 2.3 to 3.9 times lower than in individuals who are unvaccinated or have only received one or two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine Your own data is saying the opposite of what you purport it to.
  - headsoup 5y ago
    You didn't read at all. The stats are adjusted for populations within those cohorts.
  - roenxi 5y ago
    It is an appropriate use of statistics regardless. The main thrust of headsoup's argument was that the focus on unvaxxed people isn't helpful because they aren't important in absolute terms. The rate doesn't matter so much in this instance, because most resources would still be spend on vaccinated people. Much like the fact that when I eventually catch COVID the odds are really good that I'm going to get it off someone who is vaccinated. If we hypothetically rounded up all the unvaxxed tomorrow most of the strain on the hospital system faces in Scotland would still be there. Vaccination campaigns can't really change that.

aqme28 5y ago

A) This is counter to everything I can find online. Going to need citations. B) This is true. Not sure how it relates to my point though. C) Aren't we doing both? I've seen both "get vaccinated" and "be healthy" messaging this whole pandemic. Again though, not sure how it relates. D) True. Again, not sure how this relates. E) That was a big effect when vaccines just came out, but is a much smaller effect now. Though I hadn't heard this before, and would be curious to see a study on it if you have one: "when your immune system is weaker and succeptible to catching a bad case of covid." Edit: Your thing about susceptibility after vaccination is incorrect. It's an Alex Berenson talking point that has been thoroughly debunked.