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As a European you probably don't have an outdoor heated pool & hot tub in a frigid northern climate. I also think it's ridiculous, for what it's worth. 400A is

As a European you probably don't have an outdoor heated pool & hot tub in a frigid northern climate. I also think it's ridiculous, for what it's worth. 400A is a wild amount of electricity for a supposedly high efficiency, modern home.

zrail 5y ago
My house has 350A split across two meters because we have a ground source heat pump which has a special electric rate. I don't think we ever actually use that much power.
- skeletal88 5y ago
  Where I live we have to pay to the electric grid for the amps on the main breaker. Because the grid has to be able to provide those, needs to be planned accordingly, needs to have the proper diameter cables and transformers, etc. Even if we don't use them. So having 300A "just in case we need it" would be insanely expensive on the monthly bill. This amount of apmeres is more like for a workshop, small industrial or office building
  - mediaman 5y ago
    Many utilities will do this based not on the amperage to the house but the peak kw used in a billing cycle - a capacity charge. This helps incentivize reduced peak usage. In your scenario it's strange because you have zero incentive to keep your maximum usage below the breaker amount, other than the per-kwh cost.
    - wernerb 5y ago
      I live in the same such country with such rules. They assume rightly that if you request that amperage you will use it and they will plan and bill you to handle it. And yes we then also pay per kWh :) Why would it be harmful to run at the amperage that I'm buying ? What disincentives do I need?
mips_avatar 5y ago
You'll find a hot tub/sauna in most Scandinavian cabins.
- cromulent 5y ago
  Yeah, but wood-heated right, and emptied before it goes solid.
  - burmanm 5y ago
    No, a lot of saunas in Finland are electric heated. But they're still only 3*16A at most (and usually a lot less, but that depends on the size of the sauna). I think mine is ~7kW and still heats the sauna to high temperatures, just takes a bit more time. I still don't get though, if living in rural area, why not heat the pool with wood. It just has that sensation that electric heater doesn't provide.
    - mediaman 5y ago
      Is this for a wood-construction sauna with a heater warming up rocks that you can steam water off of? That's a lot less mass to warm up, mostly air, and a lot less ongoing energy loss than a big heated pool.
    - lazide 5y ago
      There is a common saying when living in areas when using wood for heat - ‘Wood warms you up three times. Once when you cut it, once when you split it, and once when you burn it’. The amount of manual labor and time required to keep a pool warm from wood is monumental. It will definitely keep a fit man in the prime of his life busy and tired. It isn’t something to sign up for lightly, especially for someone who may not have that kind of physical strength (or want it spent on heating their pool).
    - cma 5y ago
      > why not heat the pool with wood. It just has that sensation that electric heater doesn't provide. Is this some kind of new homeopathy? Wood memory gets into the water making two types of heat have a different sensation?

zrail 5y ago

My house has 350A split across two meters because we have a ground source heat pump which has a special electric rate. I don't think we ever actually use that much power.

skeletal88 5y ago
Where I live we have to pay to the electric grid for the amps on the main breaker. Because the grid has to be able to provide those, needs to be planned accordingly, needs to have the proper diameter cables and transformers, etc. Even if we don't use them. So having 300A "just in case we need it" would be insanely expensive on the monthly bill. This amount of apmeres is more like for a workshop, small industrial or office building
- mediaman 5y ago
  Many utilities will do this based not on the amperage to the house but the peak kw used in a billing cycle - a capacity charge. This helps incentivize reduced peak usage. In your scenario it's strange because you have zero incentive to keep your maximum usage below the breaker amount, other than the per-kwh cost.
  - wernerb 5y ago
    I live in the same such country with such rules. They assume rightly that if you request that amperage you will use it and they will plan and bill you to handle it. And yes we then also pay per kWh :) Why would it be harmful to run at the amperage that I'm buying ? What disincentives do I need?

mips_avatar 5y ago

You'll find a hot tub/sauna in most Scandinavian cabins.

cromulent 5y ago
Yeah, but wood-heated right, and emptied before it goes solid.
- burmanm 5y ago
  No, a lot of saunas in Finland are electric heated. But they're still only 3*16A at most (and usually a lot less, but that depends on the size of the sauna). I think mine is ~7kW and still heats the sauna to high temperatures, just takes a bit more time. I still don't get though, if living in rural area, why not heat the pool with wood. It just has that sensation that electric heater doesn't provide.
  - mediaman 5y ago
    Is this for a wood-construction sauna with a heater warming up rocks that you can steam water off of? That's a lot less mass to warm up, mostly air, and a lot less ongoing energy loss than a big heated pool.
  - lazide 5y ago
    There is a common saying when living in areas when using wood for heat - ‘Wood warms you up three times. Once when you cut it, once when you split it, and once when you burn it’. The amount of manual labor and time required to keep a pool warm from wood is monumental. It will definitely keep a fit man in the prime of his life busy and tired. It isn’t something to sign up for lightly, especially for someone who may not have that kind of physical strength (or want it spent on heating their pool).
  - cma 5y ago
    > why not heat the pool with wood. It just has that sensation that electric heater doesn't provide. Is this some kind of new homeopathy? Wood memory gets into the water making two types of heat have a different sensation?