4 ms·

The article reads as some sort of pub conversation rant rather than anything serious. The guy claims that Bitcoin is "playing Numberwang", for christ's sake. T

by throwaway22032 5y ago

The article reads as some sort of pub conversation rant rather than anything serious. The guy claims that Bitcoin is "playing Numberwang", for christ's sake. Then there are some hilarious misgivings. > Blocks in the blockchain are for all intents and purposes completely fixed. This means that a transaction that happened erroneously or illegally can never be changed. Or bad data can never be changed. Imagine if you move house and the gas company says: “There is literally no way to change your address in our database". Er, no, you just submit a correction to the address. Exactly the same as issuing an SQL UPDATE, it's just that at the lower level the SQL transaction of the UPDATE is stored, rather than the updated final result.

0xcde4c3db 5y ago
> The guy claims that Bitcoin is "playing Numberwang", for christ's sake. Numberwang is an absurd game show featured in the sketch comedy series That Mitchell and Webb Look. The basic "game" consists of the contestants repeatedly calling out numbers -- apparently at random most of the time -- until one of the numbers "is Numberwang", for which the contestant is (presumably) awarded points. Aren't Bitcoin nodes also guessing numbers until one of them passes a meaningless test, for which the node is then rewarded? The metaphor is imperfect (like all metaphors), but I think this one is a better fit than you're giving it credit for.
- throwaway22032 5y ago
  Yes, it's pub chat. I know what it is. Me writing this comment to you is playing snooker, because the protons are bouncing off each other and stuff. It's an attempt to discredit the network by using low-brow humour as a comparison.
  - 0xcde4c3db 5y ago
    People in the tech world pretty regularly use expressions like "dead trees" for print and "spinning rust" for magnetic disks, both of which were undeniably revolutionary and whose modern embodiments are marvels of engineering and logistics. I guess we just have very different expectations about tone in the context of this particular article.
    - throwaway22032 5y ago
      Those aren't taking the piss out of the topic.
      - giaour 5y ago
        Have you ever heard the phrase "spinning rust" used with reverence? I can assure you that those phrases are indeed taking the piss out of the topic.
antihero 5y ago
How does a correction help if the money has been stolen? Surely if it was that simple everyone could just “correct” legit transactions too?
- throwaway22032 5y ago
  I'm talking about the 'gas company has the wrong address' issue. You just update it. Erroneous transactions are a different question entirely that are too complicated to really explain in a comment. I'd basically just say though that if you want a company or state actor to be able to reverse transactions, you probably aren't interested in cryptocurrencies, and that's fine. The five pound note I just gave to my mate isn't reversible either and I like it that way.
  - kmlx 5y ago
    my bank automatically does this without me needing to do an update. worst case it just puts the money back into my account. > I'd basically just say though that if you want a company or state actor to be able to reverse transactions, you probably aren't interested in cryptocurrencies, and that's fine. reversing transactions are basic functionalities. we have enough issues as it is with fraud etc. having transactions that you cannot reverse is a complete non-starter.
    - danlugo92 5y ago
      Are you in the US? Send $1000 to a friend or anyone you owe money through Zelle, then call your bank and tell them you misclicked and sent it to the wrong person. Go ahead try it.
      - kmlx 5y ago
        not in the US, in the UK. i know financial systems in the US are about a decade behind those here. for example: we have Faster Payments in the UK. completely free instant payments between bank accounts. and when i say instant, they’re millisecond instant. if i mistype a name when sending a bank payment, it will warn me and ask for a confirmation. if i mistype a bank account but not the name it either comes back to me or it goes to the right bank account. and there are many other features like these.

0xcde4c3db 5y ago

> The guy claims that Bitcoin is "playing Numberwang", for christ's sake. Numberwang is an absurd game show featured in the sketch comedy series That Mitchell and Webb Look. The basic "game" consists of the contestants repeatedly calling out numbers -- apparently at random most of the time -- until one of the numbers "is Numberwang", for which the contestant is (presumably) awarded points. Aren't Bitcoin nodes also guessing numbers until one of them passes a meaningless test, for which the node is then rewarded? The metaphor is imperfect (like all metaphors), but I think this one is a better fit than you're giving it credit for.

throwaway22032 5y ago
Yes, it's pub chat. I know what it is. Me writing this comment to you is playing snooker, because the protons are bouncing off each other and stuff. It's an attempt to discredit the network by using low-brow humour as a comparison.
- 0xcde4c3db 5y ago
  People in the tech world pretty regularly use expressions like "dead trees" for print and "spinning rust" for magnetic disks, both of which were undeniably revolutionary and whose modern embodiments are marvels of engineering and logistics. I guess we just have very different expectations about tone in the context of this particular article.
  - throwaway22032 5y ago
    Those aren't taking the piss out of the topic.
    - giaour 5y ago
      Have you ever heard the phrase "spinning rust" used with reverence? I can assure you that those phrases are indeed taking the piss out of the topic.

antihero 5y ago

How does a correction help if the money has been stolen? Surely if it was that simple everyone could just “correct” legit transactions too?

throwaway22032 5y ago
I'm talking about the 'gas company has the wrong address' issue. You just update it. Erroneous transactions are a different question entirely that are too complicated to really explain in a comment. I'd basically just say though that if you want a company or state actor to be able to reverse transactions, you probably aren't interested in cryptocurrencies, and that's fine. The five pound note I just gave to my mate isn't reversible either and I like it that way.
- kmlx 5y ago
  my bank automatically does this without me needing to do an update. worst case it just puts the money back into my account. > I'd basically just say though that if you want a company or state actor to be able to reverse transactions, you probably aren't interested in cryptocurrencies, and that's fine. reversing transactions are basic functionalities. we have enough issues as it is with fraud etc. having transactions that you cannot reverse is a complete non-starter.
  - danlugo92 5y ago
    Are you in the US? Send $1000 to a friend or anyone you owe money through Zelle, then call your bank and tell them you misclicked and sent it to the wrong person. Go ahead try it.
    - kmlx 5y ago
      not in the US, in the UK. i know financial systems in the US are about a decade behind those here. for example: we have Faster Payments in the UK. completely free instant payments between bank accounts. and when i say instant, they’re millisecond instant. if i mistype a name when sending a bank payment, it will warn me and ask for a confirmation. if i mistype a bank account but not the name it either comes back to me or it goes to the right bank account. and there are many other features like these.