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FTA: > That’s right: they’re reviews of the podcasts themselves, not the Apple Podcasts app. Yep, this happens all the time. People often rate the message and

by mrtksn 5y ago

FTA: > That’s right: they’re reviews of the podcasts themselves, not the Apple Podcasts app. Yep, this happens all the time. People often rate the message and not the messenger. If you think about it, kind of make sense since many people would not understand who provides what in the experience. I wouldn't be surprised if Google Chrome has 5 start reviews about that great website they visited or 1 start reviews about website that was not nice to them. To put yourself in their shoes, consider how do you review a shopping experience in a supermarket. Are the low quality products the shop owners fault? Are the high quality products shop owners success? You might think that the answer is straightforward but it is not, some shops simply sell stands where the producers put their products and in other shops they are very involved through the whole experience. Time that with the recommended pattern of "Ask for a review when something good happens in your app" and you have a glee of happy users recommending the experience to everyone.

martini333 5y ago
This is exactly what happens. I have listened to a few podcast asking for a 5-star review on Apple Podcast. Most people don't know the difference.
hapidjus 5y ago
I'd say the answer is still straightforward, at least in the example you gave. To me as a customer it doesn't matter if it's the store owner who is stocking the stands or if they rent them out. I walked in to your store, handed you my money and received the item from you. If you're not vetting the producers that's on you.
- smokey_circles 5y ago
  No, that's on you. There's no standard store operational model. Some are whole chains, others are just endpoints. The onus is on you to check your assumptions if they contain something important (like what you're expecting)
- mrtksn 5y ago
  See, it's kind of a trick question. I ask you to rate the shopping experience but you rate the product you bought. Out of nowhere, a really bad shop can have very good reviews because some customers really enjoy the Mars bars. There's really no mystery in the Podcasts app getting very good reviews, people really love the experience even if the app itself might not be that good. It's just like happy Tesco customers that enjoy their Pringles and not nerding over the store design. From customers perspective, the store design and the Pringles are not separate experiences.
  - hapidjus 5y ago
    You were the one that brought up the product quality. But I'd argue that the quality of the product I went home with is part of the shopping experience. I'm not saying that that's how app reviews should work, just answering your question regarding where the blame should fall in your store example.
  - mannykannot 5y ago
    > There's really no mystery... Precisely. The author of the article is certainly not mystified by what is happening, and no-one responding here seems to be so, either. You are not suggesting that the quality of the podcast and that of the app are inseparable issues, are you?
    - mrtksn 5y ago
      > You are not suggesting that the quality of the podcast and that of the app are inseparable issues, are you? I am, actually. The experience is the listening of the podcast, how that is produced and how that is delivered are technicalities that you cannot know without investigation or prior knowledge and that is useful only if you are looking into improving or duplicating the experience. So, it makes sense to me to rate the app based on the podcasts you listened as well us the UI experience. After all, that would be the experience of other people who are about to download the app.
      - mannykannot 5y ago
- notriddle 5y ago
  By this kind of reasoning, web browsers should be held liable for the websites you visit in them.
  - hapidjus 5y ago
    If they sold access to websites and made a cut from it, yes!
    - jtbayly 5y ago
      Does Apple sell access to podcasts now?
      - hapidjus 5y ago
        Yes? Maybe? I dont know. But thats how it was framed in the example given.
- simonh 5y ago
  It's all about brand power. With the podcasts app, Apple has the brand power not the podcasts, so Apple is who users associate the experience with. If you bought a Dyson vacuum at Target and it was rubbish, you wouldn't later go to a Walmart to buy a Dyson for your mum because you trust Walmart more than Target (ok, contrived example). However if you go to a store and buy generic products that turn out to be shoddy, you're likely to hold it against the store.
JohnJamesRambo 5y ago
No it doesn’t make sense unless people are almost completely illiterate.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- malf 5y ago
  The dialog box that randomly pops up is “Rate Podcasts?” and a star widget.
ashtonbaker 5y ago
There are a lot of 1-star reviews of the Yelp app which are actually reviews of restaurants.
- dylan604 5y ago
  That kind of says a lot about the people using Yelp though
  - mig39 5y ago
    That's what's going on with the Apple Podcasts users, right? Isn't that what this article is saying? Users are rating podcasts, not the player. If you've gone through the trouble of downloading the app, and finding a podcast and listening to it, I'd say you're more likely to give it a positive review. More technically inclined people, who know the difference between the player and the podcast, are probably also more likely to use a different player, like Overcast.
    - dylan604 5y ago
      Some people think that the internet is the blue e button on their task bar. Those are the kind of people you just smile and nod. Any attempt at correcting will only lead to confusion, frustration, animosity, being asked to not come back to your parent's house, etc.
kranner 5y ago
I don't know if this is common outside Amazon India, but for almost every book listing that has any reviews at all, there is at least one negative review solely for the quality of the paper, or the book not being reasonably priced, or the packaging not being sturdy enough, or the "delivery boy"'s rudeness.
- bena 5y ago
  Of those, I'd say paper quality matters. For example, if the paper is so thin and brittle that it's hard to read the text or turn the pages without damaging the book beyond legibility, that's a problem. Now, the worst I've ever encountered are books with pages out of order.
  - kranner 5y ago
    Well the book is separate from the medium, and even just in paper/softcover there are possibly multiple editions available, some with better printing than others. Indian editions are typically cheaper and printed on inferior paper. Regardless I think the common understanding is that the content of the book should be reviewed, not its incidental presentation.
    - bena 5y ago
      I think it also depends on where your review is. If you're just doing reviews independent of medium, review just the content. The fact that you were reading a poorly stapled together print out from Jimmy down the hall is immaterial. If it's more like Amazon, where I'm reviewing this particular item I bought, people should know that the item being sold is of substandard quality and they should get the item elsewhere.
    - cgriswald 5y ago
      I have several editions of Dune by Frank Herbert. The content is identical in all cases (with the sometimes exception of various forwards); the books differ significantly in presentation. How, as someone who has already consumed the content, am I to know if a particular edition is well made or interesting enough for me to add to my collection? Maybe you think that is too niche; but Amazon has Amazon-specific versions of some books and also does print-on-demand. Without people reviewing the quality of these things, how am I to know the quality? This also extends to Blu-Ray collections and other things which contain content. Even a Kindle book isn't just the content; how well the book has been formatted matters. To the extent there is a norm, the norm is that anything related to the thing you are purchasing is fair game; things related to the seller or shipper are not. (Understanding that sometimes Amazon is more than a seller.) If you want reviews specifically of the content, you should go to sites that are specifically for reviewing content. To the extent there is a problem, the problem is that the star-rating is global for the entire review. I can't give a book 5 stars for content and 2 for book quality. And no matter how good the content, if you're charging me $20+ for a book with pages falling out, you're not getting five stars from me.

by mrtksn 5y ago

martini333 5y ago

This is exactly what happens. I have listened to a few podcast asking for a 5-star review on Apple Podcast. Most people don't know the difference.

hapidjus 5y ago

I'd say the answer is still straightforward, at least in the example you gave. To me as a customer it doesn't matter if it's the store owner who is stocking the stands or if they rent them out. I walked in to your store, handed you my money and received the item from you. If you're not vetting the producers that's on you.

smokey_circles 5y ago
No, that's on you. There's no standard store operational model. Some are whole chains, others are just endpoints. The onus is on you to check your assumptions if they contain something important (like what you're expecting)
mrtksn 5y ago
See, it's kind of a trick question. I ask you to rate the shopping experience but you rate the product you bought. Out of nowhere, a really bad shop can have very good reviews because some customers really enjoy the Mars bars. There's really no mystery in the Podcasts app getting very good reviews, people really love the experience even if the app itself might not be that good. It's just like happy Tesco customers that enjoy their Pringles and not nerding over the store design. From customers perspective, the store design and the Pringles are not separate experiences.
- hapidjus 5y ago
  You were the one that brought up the product quality. But I'd argue that the quality of the product I went home with is part of the shopping experience. I'm not saying that that's how app reviews should work, just answering your question regarding where the blame should fall in your store example.
- mannykannot 5y ago
  > There's really no mystery... Precisely. The author of the article is certainly not mystified by what is happening, and no-one responding here seems to be so, either. You are not suggesting that the quality of the podcast and that of the app are inseparable issues, are you?
  - mrtksn 5y ago
    > You are not suggesting that the quality of the podcast and that of the app are inseparable issues, are you? I am, actually. The experience is the listening of the podcast, how that is produced and how that is delivered are technicalities that you cannot know without investigation or prior knowledge and that is useful only if you are looking into improving or duplicating the experience. So, it makes sense to me to rate the app based on the podcasts you listened as well us the UI experience. After all, that would be the experience of other people who are about to download the app.
    - mannykannot 5y ago
notriddle 5y ago
By this kind of reasoning, web browsers should be held liable for the websites you visit in them.
- hapidjus 5y ago
  If they sold access to websites and made a cut from it, yes!
  - jtbayly 5y ago
    Does Apple sell access to podcasts now?
    - hapidjus 5y ago
      Yes? Maybe? I dont know. But thats how it was framed in the example given.
simonh 5y ago
It's all about brand power. With the podcasts app, Apple has the brand power not the podcasts, so Apple is who users associate the experience with. If you bought a Dyson vacuum at Target and it was rubbish, you wouldn't later go to a Walmart to buy a Dyson for your mum because you trust Walmart more than Target (ok, contrived example). However if you go to a store and buy generic products that turn out to be shoddy, you're likely to hold it against the store.

JohnJamesRambo 5y ago

No it doesn’t make sense unless people are almost completely illiterate.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
malf 5y ago
The dialog box that randomly pops up is “Rate Podcasts?” and a star widget.

ashtonbaker 5y ago

There are a lot of 1-star reviews of the Yelp app which are actually reviews of restaurants.

dylan604 5y ago
That kind of says a lot about the people using Yelp though
- mig39 5y ago
  That's what's going on with the Apple Podcasts users, right? Isn't that what this article is saying? Users are rating podcasts, not the player. If you've gone through the trouble of downloading the app, and finding a podcast and listening to it, I'd say you're more likely to give it a positive review. More technically inclined people, who know the difference between the player and the podcast, are probably also more likely to use a different player, like Overcast.
  - dylan604 5y ago
    Some people think that the internet is the blue e button on their task bar. Those are the kind of people you just smile and nod. Any attempt at correcting will only lead to confusion, frustration, animosity, being asked to not come back to your parent's house, etc.

kranner 5y ago

I don't know if this is common outside Amazon India, but for almost every book listing that has any reviews at all, there is at least one negative review solely for the quality of the paper, or the book not being reasonably priced, or the packaging not being sturdy enough, or the "delivery boy"'s rudeness.

bena 5y ago
Of those, I'd say paper quality matters. For example, if the paper is so thin and brittle that it's hard to read the text or turn the pages without damaging the book beyond legibility, that's a problem. Now, the worst I've ever encountered are books with pages out of order.
- kranner 5y ago
  Well the book is separate from the medium, and even just in paper/softcover there are possibly multiple editions available, some with better printing than others. Indian editions are typically cheaper and printed on inferior paper. Regardless I think the common understanding is that the content of the book should be reviewed, not its incidental presentation.
  - bena 5y ago
    I think it also depends on where your review is. If you're just doing reviews independent of medium, review just the content. The fact that you were reading a poorly stapled together print out from Jimmy down the hall is immaterial. If it's more like Amazon, where I'm reviewing this particular item I bought, people should know that the item being sold is of substandard quality and they should get the item elsewhere.
  - cgriswald 5y ago
    I have several editions of Dune by Frank Herbert. The content is identical in all cases (with the sometimes exception of various forwards); the books differ significantly in presentation. How, as someone who has already consumed the content, am I to know if a particular edition is well made or interesting enough for me to add to my collection? Maybe you think that is too niche; but Amazon has Amazon-specific versions of some books and also does print-on-demand. Without people reviewing the quality of these things, how am I to know the quality? This also extends to Blu-Ray collections and other things which contain content. Even a Kindle book isn't just the content; how well the book has been formatted matters. To the extent there is a norm, the norm is that anything related to the thing you are purchasing is fair game; things related to the seller or shipper are not. (Understanding that sometimes Amazon is more than a seller.) If you want reviews specifically of the content, you should go to sites that are specifically for reviewing content. To the extent there is a problem, the problem is that the star-rating is global for the entire review. I can't give a book 5 stars for content and 2 for book quality. And no matter how good the content, if you're charging me $20+ for a book with pages falling out, you're not getting five stars from me.