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> Of course this ends up being at odds with Web3 ideals I thought Web3 ideals are "Scam as many people as possible, run away laughing. It's only wrong if you g

by Ygg2 5y ago

> Of course this ends up being at odds with Web3 ideals I thought Web3 ideals are "Scam as many people as possible, run away laughing. It's only wrong if you get caught."

capableweb 5y ago
What is it with cryptocurrencies and HN that makes people make low-effort comments like this? Seems so emotional if you compare to other subjects, even threads about Facebook has better arguments for/against Facebook than with cryptocurrencies. In general HN commentators seems to be relatively emotionless and focus mostly on facts, while as soon as cryptocurrency stories appear, the threads get filled with comments like this that doesn't actually try to make faithful arguments but rather appeal to peoples emotions about cryptocurrencies. I see it happening from both sides (pro/against), but always around cryptocurrencies.
- ogogmad 5y ago
  There are similar snarky comments in some politics threads. I'm not pro-cryptocurrency, but this is how you identify HN groupthink. "Cute", "jaded", snarky comments. I mostly just downvote instead of confronting HN's groupthink.
- AgoRapide 5y ago
  Maybe because blockchains are just a Ponzi scheme while Facebook may have some actual value?
  - capableweb 5y ago
    Replying to a complaint about low-effort comments with your own low-effort comment? Brave effort, but you'd be doing everyone a favor to stop doing one-line middlebrow dismissals that have been done here at least a thousands times before. It's not creative nor interesting, which I hope is why most of us are here in the first place. I may agree or not with you, but it simply doesn't make for a good reading of the comments to hear the same thing over and over again...
    - Ygg2 5y ago
      The only way your comment isn't low effort, is that you need to do lot of mental gymnastics to just look at it and not see it as obvious scam. Like stop and think. A peer-to-peer money log with no real world guarantees.
- Ygg2 5y ago
  Well it's simple. - Cryptocurrency market is a scam.[0] - It spends inordinate amount of electrical energy that can be better spent maintaining existing bank/credit card infrastructure [1] - It's a scam[2] - It contributed to overall graphics card shortage [3] - It has another scam (NFT) growing on top of an existing one [4] Have I mentioned it's a scam? What irks me the most is people are acting as if crypto currency is real/usable or a sane solution for a problem it can't dream of solving. It feels a bit like yelling "King is naked", but the rest of the populace is "No, it's just spider silk.", and "Would they waste all that effort to just make nothing?" [0] https://www.singlelunch.com/2022/01/09/an-anatomy-of-bitcoin-price-manipulation/ https://www.singlelunch.com/2022/01/09/an-anatomy-of-bitcoin... [1] https://fortune.com/2021/10/26/bitcoin-electricity-consumption-carbon-footprin/ https://fortune.com/2021/10/26/bitcoin-electricity-consumpti... [2] https://www.theverge.com/22620464/tether-backing-cryptocurrency-stablecoin https://www.theverge.com/22620464/tether-backing-cryptocurre... [3] https://medium.com/geekculture/cryptocurrency-graphics-card-shortage-and-the-rise-of-cloud-gpu-1d5501351ed3 https://medium.com/geekculture/cryptocurrency-graphics-card-... [4] Just use your brain for 5 min and realize that NFTs don't work.
  - miracle2k 5y ago
    > [4] Just use your brain for 5 min and realize that NFTs don't work. Nothing says low-effort group think than the claim that "NFTs don't work". It is a certificate of authenticity (we know those work as the art world has been using them to sell intangible art for decades) in a spreadsheet (we know spreadsheets work). There is literally nothing there that could possible "not work".
    - Ygg2 5y ago
      > Nothing says low-effort group think than the claim that "NFTs don't work". NFTs are based on crypto currency - a scam. * You get a mined crypto, one with body that's essentially a fancy IOU. - Alarm bells begin to ring. Who enforces the IOU? The anarchist collective? * You download the funny art, by clicking the link. - Air sirens start to blast. How do you know link is secure? Could someone else already got there and download the picture? Is there a way to limit the download number. If no, they can't guarantee a single owner. If yes, can you authenticate. What if link expired? Etc. * You proudly display your art. Someone right click and save as. They now have your art for $0. Or for hell they might steal your real asset or even the NFT used to verify you own it. - What is your recourse? Who will believe you own right to online pictures? What court considers NFTs real asset?
- DonHopkins 5y ago
  People make comments like that to counter the low-effort cryptocurrency shilling and parroting of lame boilerplate ignorant excuses and apologetics, which don't belong here. And just because most people here agree that anonymous internet users breathlessly shilling cryptocurrency get-rich-quick pyramid schemes here are scammers, doesn't mean it's groupthink. It's simply, objectively, and obviously true, and it's all the irrefutable evidence of scams and crimes like the subject of this discussion that cause most people here to believe the truth, not "groupthink". It's not groupthink to believe 1+1=2, and casually dismiss anyone who says otherwise. If you want to wag your accusatory "groupthink" finger at people causing actual tangible damage to the environment and economy, while lying, shilling, pumping and dumping, ripping people off, committing crimes, and laundering money with NFTs and cryptocurrency, then point it at the cryptocurrency shills parroting bullshit talking points. They're the ones all thinking and talking the same, and generating all the hype.
  - rosndo 5y ago
    > People make comments like that to counter the low-effort cryptocurrency shilling and parroting of lame boilerplate ignorant excuses and apologetics, which don't belong here How come the “counter” comments are far more common on HN than the low-effort shilling?
    - DonHopkins 5y ago
      - rosndo 5y ago
        DonHopkins 5y ago
        That's unmitigated low-effort BULLSHIT, and I will prove it: there's always been a lot of scammers trying to shill cryptocurrency on HN, but the fact that most people here don't tolerate that bullshit and quickly shoot it down, and that the moderation system makes it hard for them to reply and easy to detect sock-puppets, discourages them and hurts their precious feelings, so they usually go away for a while, or create alternate sock-puppet accounts, but they often come back eventually and keep pushing their schemes. Case in point: For an archetypical example that proves my point, take a look at notorious "SPAM KING" and crypto scammer Richard Heart's posting history and ten pages of google search results, who repeatedly tries to shill his PoS get-rich-quick pyramid schemes here. And heeeeee's baaaaack. So go take the effort to reply to HIS posts, not mine. https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=RichardHeart https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=RichardHeart https://www.google.com/search?q=SPAM+KING+Richard+J+Schueler&oq=spam+king+Richard+J+Schueler&aqs=chrome..69i57.3944j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.com/search?q=SPAM+KING+Richard+J+Schueler... I've put quite some effort into researching who he really is (his actual name is Richard J Schueler, which he changed to obscure his sordid history) and what he's done in the past (he's the winner of the "Golden Pump Award" for "Best New Scam" for "HEX", and I discovered that he's one of the first people in the world to be successfully sued for online spam, specifically the Viagra spam scheme that he ran from Panama, which he lost, under his previous name "Richard J Schueler"), and I looked into his latest racket that he's been pushing here on HN and many other places (HEX), and I've put in the effort to reply to his posts and write up the facts, with lots of links and quotes as proof, and ask him point-blank straightforward questions that he was afraid to answer, to inform other people about him, and give him a chance to explain his side of the story, which he failed to do. So did I put enough effort into replying to him, with enough links and quotes to satisfy your curiosity and thirst for proof? Is that high enough effort for you or not? Or now is that TOO MUCH effort in your opinion? Or do you actually think I OWE him even more of my time and effort replying to his frequent and fraudulent shilling and dodging questions? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27224524 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27224524 >[...] Richard J Schueler, it's true that you're a biased shill, but there are many other very legitimate reasons not to listen to anything you say, such as the fact that you falsely claim that proof of stake is a proven successful replacement for proof of work. And also the following reasons, based on your own words, that I will cite and link to, and the fact that you refuse to address them and answer simple straightforward questions, and repeat things like "Dodge, dodge" instead. Confronting Richard Heart of HEX - SPAM KING and Crypto Scammer https://www.cointelligence.com/content/confronting-richard-heart-of-hex-spam-king-and-crypto-scammer/ https://www.cointelligence.com/content/confronting-richard-h... >[...] So why don't YOU take your own advice, put your shitcoin where your mouth is, and show us exactly what a high effort reply to cryptocurrency shilling (that's also not too much effort) would look like, instead of showering us with so many low effort whiney uninformative bullshit defenses of cryptocurrency shills, and petulantly complaining about other people's low effort replies to them? SHOW don't TELL. The ball's in your court. Or is that not how you roll, because you're actually just yet another tone policing concern troll, hiding behind a pseudonym, who will simply "Dodge, Dodge" and create another sock-puppet account after you've burnt this one, rosndo? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone_policing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone_policing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll#Concern_troll https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll#Concern_troll
- IncRnd 5y ago
  > What is it with cryptocurrencies and HN that makes people make low-effort comments like this? The idiom, "the truth hurts," means that hearing the unvarnished truth makes one experience sadness or other such negative emotions. You are replying to one such truthful comment.
- SantalBlush 5y ago
  >In general HN commentators seems to be relatively emotionless and focus mostly on facts This is a myth. Commenters on HN are good at disguising emotional arguments as reasoned arguments. That's not to say that people don't apply logic here--they certainly do--but don't be fooled into thinking that HN comments are relatively emotionless.
dang 5y ago
Please keep tedious generic flamewars off HN. Anything which has been repeated so often is off-topic here (https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=curiosity%20repetition%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...), and shallow flamebait is against the site guidelines to begin with. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30188256 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30188256.

by Ygg2 5y ago

> Of course this ends up being at odds with Web3 ideals I thought Web3 ideals are "Scam as many people as possible, run away laughing. It's only wrong if you get caught."

capableweb 5y ago

What is it with cryptocurrencies and HN that makes people make low-effort comments like this? Seems so emotional if you compare to other subjects, even threads about Facebook has better arguments for/against Facebook than with cryptocurrencies. In general HN commentators seems to be relatively emotionless and focus mostly on facts, while as soon as cryptocurrency stories appear, the threads get filled with comments like this that doesn't actually try to make faithful arguments but rather appeal to peoples emotions about cryptocurrencies. I see it happening from both sides (pro/against), but always around cryptocurrencies.

ogogmad 5y ago
There are similar snarky comments in some politics threads. I'm not pro-cryptocurrency, but this is how you identify HN groupthink. "Cute", "jaded", snarky comments. I mostly just downvote instead of confronting HN's groupthink.
AgoRapide 5y ago
Maybe because blockchains are just a Ponzi scheme while Facebook may have some actual value?
- capableweb 5y ago
  Replying to a complaint about low-effort comments with your own low-effort comment? Brave effort, but you'd be doing everyone a favor to stop doing one-line middlebrow dismissals that have been done here at least a thousands times before. It's not creative nor interesting, which I hope is why most of us are here in the first place. I may agree or not with you, but it simply doesn't make for a good reading of the comments to hear the same thing over and over again...
  - Ygg2 5y ago
    The only way your comment isn't low effort, is that you need to do lot of mental gymnastics to just look at it and not see it as obvious scam. Like stop and think. A peer-to-peer money log with no real world guarantees.
Ygg2 5y ago
Well it's simple. - Cryptocurrency market is a scam.[0] - It spends inordinate amount of electrical energy that can be better spent maintaining existing bank/credit card infrastructure [1] - It's a scam[2] - It contributed to overall graphics card shortage [3] - It has another scam (NFT) growing on top of an existing one [4] Have I mentioned it's a scam? What irks me the most is people are acting as if crypto currency is real/usable or a sane solution for a problem it can't dream of solving. It feels a bit like yelling "King is naked", but the rest of the populace is "No, it's just spider silk.", and "Would they waste all that effort to just make nothing?" [0] https://www.singlelunch.com/2022/01/09/an-anatomy-of-bitcoin-price-manipulation/ https://www.singlelunch.com/2022/01/09/an-anatomy-of-bitcoin... [1] https://fortune.com/2021/10/26/bitcoin-electricity-consumption-carbon-footprin/ https://fortune.com/2021/10/26/bitcoin-electricity-consumpti... [2] https://www.theverge.com/22620464/tether-backing-cryptocurrency-stablecoin https://www.theverge.com/22620464/tether-backing-cryptocurre... [3] https://medium.com/geekculture/cryptocurrency-graphics-card-shortage-and-the-rise-of-cloud-gpu-1d5501351ed3 https://medium.com/geekculture/cryptocurrency-graphics-card-... [4] Just use your brain for 5 min and realize that NFTs don't work.
- miracle2k 5y ago
  > [4] Just use your brain for 5 min and realize that NFTs don't work. Nothing says low-effort group think than the claim that "NFTs don't work". It is a certificate of authenticity (we know those work as the art world has been using them to sell intangible art for decades) in a spreadsheet (we know spreadsheets work). There is literally nothing there that could possible "not work".
  - Ygg2 5y ago
    > Nothing says low-effort group think than the claim that "NFTs don't work". NFTs are based on crypto currency - a scam. * You get a mined crypto, one with body that's essentially a fancy IOU. - Alarm bells begin to ring. Who enforces the IOU? The anarchist collective? * You download the funny art, by clicking the link. - Air sirens start to blast. How do you know link is secure? Could someone else already got there and download the picture? Is there a way to limit the download number. If no, they can't guarantee a single owner. If yes, can you authenticate. What if link expired? Etc. * You proudly display your art. Someone right click and save as. They now have your art for $0. Or for hell they might steal your real asset or even the NFT used to verify you own it. - What is your recourse? Who will believe you own right to online pictures? What court considers NFTs real asset?
DonHopkins 5y ago
People make comments like that to counter the low-effort cryptocurrency shilling and parroting of lame boilerplate ignorant excuses and apologetics, which don't belong here. And just because most people here agree that anonymous internet users breathlessly shilling cryptocurrency get-rich-quick pyramid schemes here are scammers, doesn't mean it's groupthink. It's simply, objectively, and obviously true, and it's all the irrefutable evidence of scams and crimes like the subject of this discussion that cause most people here to believe the truth, not "groupthink". It's not groupthink to believe 1+1=2, and casually dismiss anyone who says otherwise. If you want to wag your accusatory "groupthink" finger at people causing actual tangible damage to the environment and economy, while lying, shilling, pumping and dumping, ripping people off, committing crimes, and laundering money with NFTs and cryptocurrency, then point it at the cryptocurrency shills parroting bullshit talking points. They're the ones all thinking and talking the same, and generating all the hype.
- rosndo 5y ago
  > People make comments like that to counter the low-effort cryptocurrency shilling and parroting of lame boilerplate ignorant excuses and apologetics, which don't belong here How come the “counter” comments are far more common on HN than the low-effort shilling?
  - DonHopkins 5y ago
    - rosndo 5y ago
      - DonHopkins 5y ago
        That's unmitigated low-effort BULLSHIT, and I will prove it: there's always been a lot of scammers trying to shill cryptocurrency on HN, but the fact that most people here don't tolerate that bullshit and quickly shoot it down, and that the moderation system makes it hard for them to reply and easy to detect sock-puppets, discourages them and hurts their precious feelings, so they usually go away for a while, or create alternate sock-puppet accounts, but they often come back eventually and keep pushing their schemes. Case in point: For an archetypical example that proves my point, take a look at notorious "SPAM KING" and crypto scammer Richard Heart's posting history and ten pages of google search results, who repeatedly tries to shill his PoS get-rich-quick pyramid schemes here. And heeeeee's baaaaack. So go take the effort to reply to HIS posts, not mine. https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=RichardHeart https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=RichardHeart https://www.google.com/search?q=SPAM+KING+Richard+J+Schueler&oq=spam+king+Richard+J+Schueler&aqs=chrome..69i57.3944j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 https://www.google.com/search?q=SPAM+KING+Richard+J+Schueler... I've put quite some effort into researching who he really is (his actual name is Richard J Schueler, which he changed to obscure his sordid history) and what he's done in the past (he's the winner of the "Golden Pump Award" for "Best New Scam" for "HEX", and I discovered that he's one of the first people in the world to be successfully sued for online spam, specifically the Viagra spam scheme that he ran from Panama, which he lost, under his previous name "Richard J Schueler"), and I looked into his latest racket that he's been pushing here on HN and many other places (HEX), and I've put in the effort to reply to his posts and write up the facts, with lots of links and quotes as proof, and ask him point-blank straightforward questions that he was afraid to answer, to inform other people about him, and give him a chance to explain his side of the story, which he failed to do. So did I put enough effort into replying to him, with enough links and quotes to satisfy your curiosity and thirst for proof? Is that high enough effort for you or not? Or now is that TOO MUCH effort in your opinion? Or do you actually think I OWE him even more of my time and effort replying to his frequent and fraudulent shilling and dodging questions? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27224524 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27224524 >[...] Richard J Schueler, it's true that you're a biased shill, but there are many other very legitimate reasons not to listen to anything you say, such as the fact that you falsely claim that proof of stake is a proven successful replacement for proof of work. And also the following reasons, based on your own words, that I will cite and link to, and the fact that you refuse to address them and answer simple straightforward questions, and repeat things like "Dodge, dodge" instead. Confronting Richard Heart of HEX - SPAM KING and Crypto Scammer https://www.cointelligence.com/content/confronting-richard-heart-of-hex-spam-king-and-crypto-scammer/ https://www.cointelligence.com/content/confronting-richard-h... >[...] So why don't YOU take your own advice, put your shitcoin where your mouth is, and show us exactly what a high effort reply to cryptocurrency shilling (that's also not too much effort) would look like, instead of showering us with so many low effort whiney uninformative bullshit defenses of cryptocurrency shills, and petulantly complaining about other people's low effort replies to them? SHOW don't TELL. The ball's in your court. Or is that not how you roll, because you're actually just yet another tone policing concern troll, hiding behind a pseudonym, who will simply "Dodge, Dodge" and create another sock-puppet account after you've burnt this one, rosndo? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone_policing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone_policing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll#Concern_troll https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll#Concern_troll
IncRnd 5y ago
> What is it with cryptocurrencies and HN that makes people make low-effort comments like this? The idiom, "the truth hurts," means that hearing the unvarnished truth makes one experience sadness or other such negative emotions. You are replying to one such truthful comment.
SantalBlush 5y ago
>In general HN commentators seems to be relatively emotionless and focus mostly on facts This is a myth. Commenters on HN are good at disguising emotional arguments as reasoned arguments. That's not to say that people don't apply logic here--they certainly do--but don't be fooled into thinking that HN comments are relatively emotionless.

dang 5y ago

Please keep tedious generic flamewars off HN. Anything which has been repeated so often is off-topic here (https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=curiosity%20repetition%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...), and shallow flamebait is against the site guidelines to begin with. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30188256 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30188256.