5 ms·

I find the oh-so-witty replies of "I didn't know Vice was journalism nyuknyuknyuk" to be about as much of a distraction from the issue as when cable news statio

by z3c0 5y ago

I find the oh-so-witty replies of "I didn't know Vice was journalism nyuknyuknyuk" to be about as much of a distraction from the issue as when cable news stations retort that they're "entertainment, not news" when in the hot seat for a false claim. Say what you will of the quality of their journalism, but at the end of the day, a journalistic organization is openly courting a regime that lured a journalist to his death under false pretenses, and then hacked his body into pieces, cooked the pieces of his body in a firepit, and forced his family to attend kangaroo court to witness pawns being scapegoated for Mohammed bin Salman. Vice, US legislators, and most importantly, Mohammed bin Salman himself need to realize that we're not going to forget the despicable and disgusting human-being that Mohammed bin Salman is, and that any institutions that deal with him are guilty by association.

mistrial9 5y ago
the deserts are soaked in blood; this one killing is a political statement, and display of skill and cruelty by the perpetrators to scare others. The armchair rage is literally laughable by people who do and practice these things, as a way of life.
- z3c0 5y ago
  The punchline emerges from the complacent who will allow it to happen, while patting themselves on the back for how "pragmatic" they are - not from the "armchair outrage".
pessimizer 5y ago
> need to realize that we're not going to forget But we definitely are, or rather clearly already have, so I'm not sure what repeating declarations like this does other than "virtue signal." If you work for a company that takes Saudi money, are you ready to quit, even knowing that no one will care?
- 8f2ab37a-ed6c 5y ago
  It's been a painful realization for those of us who grew up idealistic, taught in school that we, "the good guys", would rise up and together fight injustice, inequities and human right violations together the way "we" have in WW2. Turns out that genocides, massacres, concentration camps, slavery and co are something that the West will gladly overlook because ultimately everybody's got a mortgage to pay, and the tedious moral grandstanding is nothing but empty PR. Nobody gives a shit, you just can't say that out loud. You need to make sure to Tweet your support for the right cause, and then go back to climbing your local power ladder of choice 30 seconds after hitting post. I realize this sounds cynical, but I don't think there's much evidence to support a more optimistic outlook, at least as far as geopolitics go.
- ghostbrainalpha 5y ago
  Funny that you mention "virtue signaling" because the name of the Vice sub company that organizes parties is "Virtue".
- z3c0 5y ago
  Yes, I would quit my job if they were taking Saudi money. My job prospects are not dire enough that I have to compromise my personal ethics. Do you only hold beliefs that you think people will care about? Are your principles founded on whether or not stating them will be perceived as "virtue signaling"?
  - pessimizer 5y ago
    This is a serious question. Have you checked? Saudi money is everywhere in tech. edit: to answer your question about my principles, they involve not inflating the importance of the dismembering of a journalist by a despot against the similar or worse, less publicized evils of other funding sources. Khashoggi isn't my issue. I cared about 100x more about the women who did the driving protests who were jailed after the Saudis loosened up laws against women driving. I cared about that while the paper that employed Khashoggi was doing intense PR on behalf of MBS in every issue.
    - z3c0 5y ago
      Your follow-up caused me naught but a deep hopelessness for the state of activism, something I have participated in for over a decade. As I said to the other commenter: > The punchline emerges from the complacent who will allow it to happen, while patting themselves on the back for how "pragmatic" they are - not from the "armchair outrage". It appears you have no issue reaching your back.
newbie789 5y ago
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

by z3c0 5y ago

mistrial9 5y ago

the deserts are soaked in blood; this one killing is a political statement, and display of skill and cruelty by the perpetrators to scare others. The armchair rage is literally laughable by people who do and practice these things, as a way of life.

z3c0 5y ago
The punchline emerges from the complacent who will allow it to happen, while patting themselves on the back for how "pragmatic" they are - not from the "armchair outrage".

pessimizer 5y ago

> need to realize that we're not going to forget But we definitely are, or rather clearly already have, so I'm not sure what repeating declarations like this does other than "virtue signal." If you work for a company that takes Saudi money, are you ready to quit, even knowing that no one will care?

8f2ab37a-ed6c 5y ago
It's been a painful realization for those of us who grew up idealistic, taught in school that we, "the good guys", would rise up and together fight injustice, inequities and human right violations together the way "we" have in WW2. Turns out that genocides, massacres, concentration camps, slavery and co are something that the West will gladly overlook because ultimately everybody's got a mortgage to pay, and the tedious moral grandstanding is nothing but empty PR. Nobody gives a shit, you just can't say that out loud. You need to make sure to Tweet your support for the right cause, and then go back to climbing your local power ladder of choice 30 seconds after hitting post. I realize this sounds cynical, but I don't think there's much evidence to support a more optimistic outlook, at least as far as geopolitics go.
ghostbrainalpha 5y ago
Funny that you mention "virtue signaling" because the name of the Vice sub company that organizes parties is "Virtue".
z3c0 5y ago
Yes, I would quit my job if they were taking Saudi money. My job prospects are not dire enough that I have to compromise my personal ethics. Do you only hold beliefs that you think people will care about? Are your principles founded on whether or not stating them will be perceived as "virtue signaling"?
- pessimizer 5y ago
  This is a serious question. Have you checked? Saudi money is everywhere in tech. edit: to answer your question about my principles, they involve not inflating the importance of the dismembering of a journalist by a despot against the similar or worse, less publicized evils of other funding sources. Khashoggi isn't my issue. I cared about 100x more about the women who did the driving protests who were jailed after the Saudis loosened up laws against women driving. I cared about that while the paper that employed Khashoggi was doing intense PR on behalf of MBS in every issue.
  - z3c0 5y ago
    Your follow-up caused me naught but a deep hopelessness for the state of activism, something I have participated in for over a decade. As I said to the other commenter: > The punchline emerges from the complacent who will allow it to happen, while patting themselves on the back for how "pragmatic" they are - not from the "armchair outrage". It appears you have no issue reaching your back.

newbie789 5y ago

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]