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What can we do to get more women into coding?

dusted 5y ago
I guess we need to alter womens brain structure to be more like mens brains so they generally find technical details more fascinating.. Or we could let people be people and have the interests they do no matter their gender.
PaulHoule 5y ago
When a question gets asked over and over again and no progress ever gets made it's worth asking "are we asking the right question?" Programming was a woman's occupation up to 1970 or so. Woman did a lot of programming on the computers that got men to the moon. It might be equally or more productive to ask why we can't get more men working in early childhood education.
- friendlydog 5y ago
  To your why men working in early childhood education isn't popular, it is probably because people have a natural fear of males and the young, because of the years of data of the animal kingdom where males often kill the young and are naturally separated. To the question of women in programming, I have no idea why the interest isn't there, but I have known several women programmers who were an asset to the teams they joined, I have known a few that were not, and several men who were not, but percentage wise in my experience I didn't see one group as overwhelming better than the other. You always get some defective programmers.
  - PaulHoule 5y ago
    I coached kindergarten soccer together with a woman and found that kids were scared of my beard so I shaved my beard. After that I did that I felt like I fit in just fine. (Personally I can't stand soccer on a large field, it's an exercise in unaccountability, be it youth soccer or pro soccer but I find small field soccer really exciting) I think the early childhood education is critical, more so than the most of the 'bias' situations that people are concerned about because: (1) a lot of boys get the message that education is a girl thing and tune out, and (2) it feeds into the "fear of males" which is toxic to relationships and may lead to women feeling more welcome in more workplaces. Generally it will have an impact on diversity and bias issues 20 years down the road. Rather than endless handwringing and ineffective actions 20 years from now it will add to the right candidates being available for more jobs and getting hired.
phkahler 5y ago
Why is this a thing? Women certainly have the ability and opportunity to get into programming if they want to. Why do some people feel that more women should get into programming? Why do you know so well what a group of people should be doing?
- jimmyvalmer 5y ago
  Because the office grind would be a little less demoralizing if it weren't a perpetual sausagefest.
  - phkahler 5y ago
    >> Because the office grind would be a little less demoralizing if it weren't a perpetual sausagefest. Even have your roof done? Bunch of guys listening to classic rock hammering away. I don't see anyone advocating for more women roofers to reduce the sausagefest up there.
    - jimmyvalmer 5y ago
      Wokesters can't go around advocating for more Asians in professional sports because given the rarefied samples involved, the eyesore of Asian on-the-field performance would be too difficult to defend. Same is true for women roofers. IT work however is just the right mix of bang and plausible denial.
  - phkahler 5y ago
    >> Because the office grind would be a little less demoralizing if it weren't a perpetual sausagefest. Even have your roof done? Bunch of guys listening to classic rock hammering away. I don't see anyone advocating for more women roofers to reduce the sausagefest up there.
- ldiracdelta 5y ago
  I have a female relative who agitates for more women in programming, meanwhile has a degree in coding and .... doesn't like coding so doesn't code. Yeah, anecdote, but also emlematic of the problem.
Bostonian 5y ago
It's my impression that some language communities have a higher fraction of women than others, although none approach 50% AFAIK. For example, looking at the names of R package contributors, it's my impression that a higher fraction are female than for Fortran-related projects on GitHub. (I use both languages.) Is the R community doing something different from others?

I guess we need to alter womens brain structure to be more like mens brains so they generally find technical details more fascinating.. Or we could let people be people and have the interests they do no matter their gender.

PaulHoule 5y ago

When a question gets asked over and over again and no progress ever gets made it's worth asking "are we asking the right question?" Programming was a woman's occupation up to 1970 or so. Woman did a lot of programming on the computers that got men to the moon. It might be equally or more productive to ask why we can't get more men working in early childhood education.

friendlydog 5y ago
To your why men working in early childhood education isn't popular, it is probably because people have a natural fear of males and the young, because of the years of data of the animal kingdom where males often kill the young and are naturally separated. To the question of women in programming, I have no idea why the interest isn't there, but I have known several women programmers who were an asset to the teams they joined, I have known a few that were not, and several men who were not, but percentage wise in my experience I didn't see one group as overwhelming better than the other. You always get some defective programmers.
- PaulHoule 5y ago
  I coached kindergarten soccer together with a woman and found that kids were scared of my beard so I shaved my beard. After that I did that I felt like I fit in just fine. (Personally I can't stand soccer on a large field, it's an exercise in unaccountability, be it youth soccer or pro soccer but I find small field soccer really exciting) I think the early childhood education is critical, more so than the most of the 'bias' situations that people are concerned about because: (1) a lot of boys get the message that education is a girl thing and tune out, and (2) it feeds into the "fear of males" which is toxic to relationships and may lead to women feeling more welcome in more workplaces. Generally it will have an impact on diversity and bias issues 20 years down the road. Rather than endless handwringing and ineffective actions 20 years from now it will add to the right candidates being available for more jobs and getting hired.

phkahler 5y ago

Why is this a thing? Women certainly have the ability and opportunity to get into programming if they want to. Why do some people feel that more women should get into programming? Why do you know so well what a group of people should be doing?

jimmyvalmer 5y ago
Because the office grind would be a little less demoralizing if it weren't a perpetual sausagefest.
- phkahler 5y ago
  >> Because the office grind would be a little less demoralizing if it weren't a perpetual sausagefest. Even have your roof done? Bunch of guys listening to classic rock hammering away. I don't see anyone advocating for more women roofers to reduce the sausagefest up there.
  - jimmyvalmer 5y ago
    Wokesters can't go around advocating for more Asians in professional sports because given the rarefied samples involved, the eyesore of Asian on-the-field performance would be too difficult to defend. Same is true for women roofers. IT work however is just the right mix of bang and plausible denial.
- phkahler 5y ago
  >> Because the office grind would be a little less demoralizing if it weren't a perpetual sausagefest. Even have your roof done? Bunch of guys listening to classic rock hammering away. I don't see anyone advocating for more women roofers to reduce the sausagefest up there.
ldiracdelta 5y ago
I have a female relative who agitates for more women in programming, meanwhile has a degree in coding and .... doesn't like coding so doesn't code. Yeah, anecdote, but also emlematic of the problem.

Bostonian 5y ago

It's my impression that some language communities have a higher fraction of women than others, although none approach 50% AFAIK. For example, looking at the names of R package contributors, it's my impression that a higher fraction are female than for Fortran-related projects on GitHub. (I use both languages.) Is the R community doing something different from others?