4 ms·

Sports betting has been legal in Europe for a very long time and we have yet to see a UEFA Champions League thrown.

wolverine876 5y ago
That you know of. How does anyone know? Edits: Imagine the NFL learns that yesterday's NFC Championship game was fixed. What would they do? Make it public and destroy their entire enterprise? My guess is that many would hide it if they could, and the people involved certainly wouldn't want to talk about it. And imagine if they learn about it in 6 months, long after the Super Bowl. Just in terms of on-field results, how do they fix the problem? Take back the trophy from a team and city that thought they won it six months ago? Replay the game in August?
- dylan604 5y ago
  >That you know of. How does anyone know? How many of those skied shots, sliced shots, etc were bad skill or skillfully done to ensure the line was what was needed/required? It's a pandora's box to start looking at everything a professional athlete/ref/manager does through that lens. It's even worse if you've never done it yourself to see how easy it is to do the wrong thing that causes one to look amateurish.
  - wolverine876 5y ago
    What is your solution? Should we just close our eyes to the threat?
    - dylan604 5y ago
      >What is your solution? Did I just get a promotion to CAS[0]? Time to update my CV. I feel special. Time for me to start accepting bribes. It's sport. It's humans. There is no solve. People want to do it, they will find a way to do it. There are other people that will take advantage. To the point that those in charge of $sportingEvent (FIFA, Olympics, Cycling) all "fall victim". > Should we just close our eyes to the threat? Only if you want to miss the entertainment. [0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court_of_Arbitration_for_Sport https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court_of_Arbitration_for_Sport
      - wolverine876 5y ago
        > It's sport. It's humans. There is no solve. People say that about a lot of things, but we humans have moved out of caves, created science, machines, governments, freedom, etc etc. We can do something about our condition.
        dylan604 5y ago
        Yes, we also have religion. Some would view that as big of a vice as gambling etc. Not sure your point is carrying much weight with me.
        wolverine876 5y ago
        What do you believe? There is nothing we can do about our society? Everything is inevitable?
- sien 5y ago
  What if the best player of all time was involved in side betting on games and got caught? Perhaps the League would even suspend him and make him retire for a few years before he could come back. But they would keep it very quiet. https://lastwordonsports.com/basketball/2019/11/29/michael-jordan-massive-gambling-habit/ https://lastwordonsports.com/basketball/2019/11/29/michael-j...
- asdff 5y ago
  This is hilarious because when this exact scenario played out with the MLB with the astros and the red socks not too long ago this is pretty much what happened. It certainly soured a lot of fans on the integrity of the league.
- noxvilleza 5y ago
  One of the best ways of knowing is by analyzing a large number of bets made punters from multiple sports books - it's easier to spot irregular betting patterns in this regard.
  - wolverine876 5y ago
    Interesting and it seems powerful, but there is plenty of fraud in the securities markets and they are much higher stakes and more closely regulated than gambling.
- vgeek 5y ago
  You can see what happens in an already dying sport that has its largest event tainted by a cheater (KY Derby & Bob Baffert). The cheater sues the company that issued a temporary ban due to his cheating. The fans are in the wind, the horse is now deceased (probably attributable) and the offender will probably end up with a shorter ban/wrist slap. He, and others, have been caught numerous times for the same types of offenses, but it normally gets swept under the rug until it boils over and hurts the sport even more by occurring on the largest stage of the year.
- philwelch 5y ago
  You're right, maybe it's all rigged. Maybe the 2020 election was rigged too, and 9/11 was an elaborate case of insurance fraud. Maybe birds aren't real. But unless there is evidence for these types of claims, there's no reason for anyone to take them seriously.
MengerSponge 5y ago
You sure about that? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calciopoli https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calciopoli
- sien 5y ago
  That's not the Champion's League. At the highest level there is so much money involved in playing the game straight that it's probably not worth it. Look at the comments here on lower levels and College sport in the US. Where people are not getting paid much then even small bribes (say $5K) can work easily. In the Premier League and what preceded it there was a betting scandal about people betting on the first thrown in of a game. FWIW drugs at the highest level soccer is quite probably a thing. Quite a number of the drug doctors from the Tour De France wound up at top European Clubs (particularly Spanish ones). Modern pressing uses heaps of running and fitness.

That you know of. How does anyone know? Edits: Imagine the NFL learns that yesterday's NFC Championship game was fixed. What would they do? Make it public and destroy their entire enterprise? My guess is that many would hide it if they could, and the people involved certainly wouldn't want to talk about it. And imagine if they learn about it in 6 months, long after the Super Bowl. Just in terms of on-field results, how do they fix the problem? Take back the trophy from a team and city that thought they won it six months ago? Replay the game in August?

dylan604 5y ago
>That you know of. How does anyone know? How many of those skied shots, sliced shots, etc were bad skill or skillfully done to ensure the line was what was needed/required? It's a pandora's box to start looking at everything a professional athlete/ref/manager does through that lens. It's even worse if you've never done it yourself to see how easy it is to do the wrong thing that causes one to look amateurish.
- wolverine876 5y ago
  What is your solution? Should we just close our eyes to the threat?
  - dylan604 5y ago
    >What is your solution? Did I just get a promotion to CAS[0]? Time to update my CV. I feel special. Time for me to start accepting bribes. It's sport. It's humans. There is no solve. People want to do it, they will find a way to do it. There are other people that will take advantage. To the point that those in charge of $sportingEvent (FIFA, Olympics, Cycling) all "fall victim". > Should we just close our eyes to the threat? Only if you want to miss the entertainment. [0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court_of_Arbitration_for_Sport https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court_of_Arbitration_for_Sport
    - wolverine876 5y ago
      > It's sport. It's humans. There is no solve. People say that about a lot of things, but we humans have moved out of caves, created science, machines, governments, freedom, etc etc. We can do something about our condition.
      - dylan604 5y ago
        Yes, we also have religion. Some would view that as big of a vice as gambling etc. Not sure your point is carrying much weight with me.
        wolverine876 5y ago
        What do you believe? There is nothing we can do about our society? Everything is inevitable?
sien 5y ago
What if the best player of all time was involved in side betting on games and got caught? Perhaps the League would even suspend him and make him retire for a few years before he could come back. But they would keep it very quiet. https://lastwordonsports.com/basketball/2019/11/29/michael-jordan-massive-gambling-habit/ https://lastwordonsports.com/basketball/2019/11/29/michael-j...
asdff 5y ago
This is hilarious because when this exact scenario played out with the MLB with the astros and the red socks not too long ago this is pretty much what happened. It certainly soured a lot of fans on the integrity of the league.
noxvilleza 5y ago
One of the best ways of knowing is by analyzing a large number of bets made punters from multiple sports books - it's easier to spot irregular betting patterns in this regard.
- wolverine876 5y ago
  Interesting and it seems powerful, but there is plenty of fraud in the securities markets and they are much higher stakes and more closely regulated than gambling.
vgeek 5y ago
You can see what happens in an already dying sport that has its largest event tainted by a cheater (KY Derby & Bob Baffert). The cheater sues the company that issued a temporary ban due to his cheating. The fans are in the wind, the horse is now deceased (probably attributable) and the offender will probably end up with a shorter ban/wrist slap. He, and others, have been caught numerous times for the same types of offenses, but it normally gets swept under the rug until it boils over and hurts the sport even more by occurring on the largest stage of the year.
philwelch 5y ago
You're right, maybe it's all rigged. Maybe the 2020 election was rigged too, and 9/11 was an elaborate case of insurance fraud. Maybe birds aren't real. But unless there is evidence for these types of claims, there's no reason for anyone to take them seriously.

MengerSponge 5y ago

You sure about that? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calciopoli https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calciopoli

sien 5y ago
That's not the Champion's League. At the highest level there is so much money involved in playing the game straight that it's probably not worth it. Look at the comments here on lower levels and College sport in the US. Where people are not getting paid much then even small bribes (say $5K) can work easily. In the Premier League and what preceded it there was a betting scandal about people betting on the first thrown in of a game. FWIW drugs at the highest level soccer is quite probably a thing. Quite a number of the drug doctors from the Tour De France wound up at top European Clubs (particularly Spanish ones). Modern pressing uses heaps of running and fitness.