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The steering wheel in an F1 car only goes about 220 degrees in either direction (drivers have to keep their hands on the wheel and their arms aren't made of rub

The steering wheel in an F1 car only goes about 220 degrees in either direction (drivers have to keep their hands on the wheel and their arms aren't made of rubber). The steering in a regular car goes about 540 degrees in either direction (one and a half times around). When parallel parking you often have to turn the wheel three whole revolutions. F1 steering https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVz6IW_wegs&t=45s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVz6IW_wegs&t=45s Tesla steering https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWtJu0q3sBQ&t=44s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWtJu0q3sBQ&t=44s

function_seven 5y ago
Your second video horrified me. What the hell are they thinking with the touch-sensitive inputs on the steering wheel? Nevermind the weird shape and the issues with orientation when signaling during a steering maneuver. Those aren't actual buttons, they're no better than a touch screen. When I drive, my hands aren't always in the exact same position on the wheel. Muscle-memory won't reliably have my thumb landing on the correct signal direction. If I have to honk the horn, I need to be able to do that instantly, without thinking. Some cutesy icon located away from the edge of the steering wheel will guarantee that the horn sounds simultaneously with the "crunch" of another car backing into me. My proposed rule-of-thumb: If a video game company wouldn't design their controllers this way, you shouldn't do it either for the most common—or most urgent—functions. Turn signals, wipers, horn, and hazard lights should all be real buttons that are in a consistent location. Horn should be in the hub of the steering wheel.
- Eji1700 5y ago
  Glad i'm not the only one who thinks this is insane. I could maybe see a yolk, but dear god get me AWAY from touch screen style buttons in any serious process, let alone ones that can wind up in different orientations. And why in the hell does a yolk need to have the horn on a button rather than the center of the yolk as anyone would expect? Maybe there's some technical reason i'm unaware of, but this seems actively dangerous for no gain. I can think of several better ways to do this that aren't actively confusing and hostile to the driver.
  - unityByFreedom 5y ago
    > And why in the hell does a yolk need to have the horn on a button rather than the center of the yolk as anyone would expect? Maybe there's some technical reason i'm unaware of No you're right, it's change for the sake of change. It is now a status symbol to show off how well you drive a vehicle whose management is more challenging than other cars.
    - rand49an 5y ago
      I feel like that is a cost decision. Instead of making the whole centre of the wheel a button you assign it to some capacitive button on the side. But I agree, that second video is insane.
      - unityByFreedom 5y ago
        They added cost by reinventing the wheel. It's a status symbol for bad drivers to pay more for something different.
  - inimino 5y ago
    > yoke Used to turn the plane. Also put on oxen to pull a plow. > yolk Yellow part of an egg.
    - spinitch 5y ago
      Yeah I was thinking, "a yolk steering wheel does sound pretty dangerous."
  - awhitby 5y ago
    The horn thing doesn't seem like that big a deal actually. I've never used the horn in a potential accident situation because there's always something better I could be focusing on to avoid the accident. As pilot say: aviate, navigate, then communicate. [0] Some studies seems to support that [1]. The only accidents I can imagine the horn preventing are ones where you are stationary, which almost always means the other car is moving slowly - like somebody backing into you in a parking lot. Overall pretty low consequence incidents. So to the extent that horn use is nearly all elective rather than emergency, is antisocial and has few benefits: make it a small, hard-to-reach button. (With important exceptions like heavy vehicles that can't maneuver well and non-Western driving cultures that rely on routine horn use to communicate intentions.) [0] Granted aircraft have an extra dimension to play in for collision-avoidance. [1] https://slate.com/technology/2008/11/honk-if-you-know-why-you-re-honking.html https://slate.com/technology/2008/11/honk-if-you-know-why-yo...
- CaptainZapp 5y ago
  > Those aren't actual buttons, they're no better than a touch screen. Your comment fondly reminded me of my very first computer, which was a Sinclair ZX81. Let's just say that it wasn't ideal for text processing. About the same as this "steering console" doesn't look quite ideal for driving a fucking car. I concur with your horrification.
  - function_seven 5y ago
    And you just reminded me of my first computer. An Atari 400. The 800 had real keys, but the 400 was just a membrane keyboard. Didn’t matter; we only used it to play video games anyway. I can’t imagine having to type on that thing.
laputan_machine 5y ago
Touch-based buttons feels like a huge step backwards. Have we learned nothing from having to use touch phones for the last 12 years, either that or everyone is much better than me at not missing touch inputs
- iforgotpassword 5y ago
  And everyone wants to be part of that cool touch movement too, by using capacitive touch buttons. So modern! And cheaper too, but that doesn't stop you from marketing it as premium. Try buying a stove with induction and normal knobs. Nope, it's touch. Cheap touch buttons, that don't work if your hands are wet, or greasy. Which totally never happens when you're cooking. So you're handling three pots, one starts boiling over. With knobs it would take me half a second to turn it off. With my awesome induction stove I'm stuck on mashing the button to select the proper field with my greasy hand which doesn't work, but at least when finally half the pot's content flows onto the touch controls the stove turns off entirely and starts beeping like crazy. But at least it's easier to clean than haptic controls.
  - Gigachad 5y ago
    Touch controls on stoves are mostly about making cleaning easier. You just wipe a flat surface.
    - tpxl 5y ago
      I'd like to introduce you to my grandmother's flat surface stove from the 70s with 0 touch controls. It's easy, just decouple the controls from the heating element. 3/4 of the reason they're touch is being 'cool' and none of the designers ever cooking a meal in their life.
      - vel0city 5y ago
        Messes go further than just the heating element. Things splatter, run over. Even with controls on the face of the range (not always practical) you may need to clean them from messes. Its definitely easy to clean my entire range being a flat piece of glass, and personally I've never had any problems with sensitivity on the buttons. Plus, that whole cook top is then still useful as a counter top as even the glass is only slightly raised over the rest of the counter surface. In my experience the glass top range I have has been wonderful, and I was originally planning on tearing it out and putting in a gas unit. I've since second guessed those plans and will probably keep the range for a while longer, no knobs has actually been pretty nice.
k3liutZu 5y ago
Really seems Tesla is regressing a lot of _important_ controls :(
darksaints 5y ago
Holy shit, everything about that Tesla experience is a nightmare.
yakshaving_jgt 5y ago
I am stunned. I am never buying a car that decides for me if I should be going forwards or in reverse. How did this anti-feature go through so many supposedly smart people? Does PHB work there also?
llbeansandrice 5y ago
That second video is horrifying. Horn and signal inputs as touch buttons on a steering wheel and no clear gear selection? What absolute madness by Tesla.
flavius29663 5y ago
how is that Tesla even legal?
- esalman 5y ago
  it makes a mockery of so many absurd rules other manufacturers in the US have to follow. Really raises question how Tesla get away with these.

function_seven 5y ago

Your second video horrified me. What the hell are they thinking with the touch-sensitive inputs on the steering wheel? Nevermind the weird shape and the issues with orientation when signaling during a steering maneuver. Those aren't actual buttons, they're no better than a touch screen. When I drive, my hands aren't always in the exact same position on the wheel. Muscle-memory won't reliably have my thumb landing on the correct signal direction. If I have to honk the horn, I need to be able to do that instantly, without thinking. Some cutesy icon located away from the edge of the steering wheel will guarantee that the horn sounds simultaneously with the "crunch" of another car backing into me. My proposed rule-of-thumb: If a video game company wouldn't design their controllers this way, you shouldn't do it either for the most common—or most urgent—functions. Turn signals, wipers, horn, and hazard lights should all be real buttons that are in a consistent location. Horn should be in the hub of the steering wheel.

Eji1700 5y ago
Glad i'm not the only one who thinks this is insane. I could maybe see a yolk, but dear god get me AWAY from touch screen style buttons in any serious process, let alone ones that can wind up in different orientations. And why in the hell does a yolk need to have the horn on a button rather than the center of the yolk as anyone would expect? Maybe there's some technical reason i'm unaware of, but this seems actively dangerous for no gain. I can think of several better ways to do this that aren't actively confusing and hostile to the driver.
- unityByFreedom 5y ago
  > And why in the hell does a yolk need to have the horn on a button rather than the center of the yolk as anyone would expect? Maybe there's some technical reason i'm unaware of No you're right, it's change for the sake of change. It is now a status symbol to show off how well you drive a vehicle whose management is more challenging than other cars.
  - rand49an 5y ago
    I feel like that is a cost decision. Instead of making the whole centre of the wheel a button you assign it to some capacitive button on the side. But I agree, that second video is insane.
    - unityByFreedom 5y ago
      They added cost by reinventing the wheel. It's a status symbol for bad drivers to pay more for something different.
- inimino 5y ago
  > yoke Used to turn the plane. Also put on oxen to pull a plow. > yolk Yellow part of an egg.
  - spinitch 5y ago
    Yeah I was thinking, "a yolk steering wheel does sound pretty dangerous."
- awhitby 5y ago
  The horn thing doesn't seem like that big a deal actually. I've never used the horn in a potential accident situation because there's always something better I could be focusing on to avoid the accident. As pilot say: aviate, navigate, then communicate. [0] Some studies seems to support that [1]. The only accidents I can imagine the horn preventing are ones where you are stationary, which almost always means the other car is moving slowly - like somebody backing into you in a parking lot. Overall pretty low consequence incidents. So to the extent that horn use is nearly all elective rather than emergency, is antisocial and has few benefits: make it a small, hard-to-reach button. (With important exceptions like heavy vehicles that can't maneuver well and non-Western driving cultures that rely on routine horn use to communicate intentions.) [0] Granted aircraft have an extra dimension to play in for collision-avoidance. [1] https://slate.com/technology/2008/11/honk-if-you-know-why-you-re-honking.html https://slate.com/technology/2008/11/honk-if-you-know-why-yo...
CaptainZapp 5y ago
> Those aren't actual buttons, they're no better than a touch screen. Your comment fondly reminded me of my very first computer, which was a Sinclair ZX81. Let's just say that it wasn't ideal for text processing. About the same as this "steering console" doesn't look quite ideal for driving a fucking car. I concur with your horrification.
- function_seven 5y ago
  And you just reminded me of my first computer. An Atari 400. The 800 had real keys, but the 400 was just a membrane keyboard. Didn’t matter; we only used it to play video games anyway. I can’t imagine having to type on that thing.

laputan_machine 5y ago

Touch-based buttons feels like a huge step backwards. Have we learned nothing from having to use touch phones for the last 12 years, either that or everyone is much better than me at not missing touch inputs

iforgotpassword 5y ago
And everyone wants to be part of that cool touch movement too, by using capacitive touch buttons. So modern! And cheaper too, but that doesn't stop you from marketing it as premium. Try buying a stove with induction and normal knobs. Nope, it's touch. Cheap touch buttons, that don't work if your hands are wet, or greasy. Which totally never happens when you're cooking. So you're handling three pots, one starts boiling over. With knobs it would take me half a second to turn it off. With my awesome induction stove I'm stuck on mashing the button to select the proper field with my greasy hand which doesn't work, but at least when finally half the pot's content flows onto the touch controls the stove turns off entirely and starts beeping like crazy. But at least it's easier to clean than haptic controls.
- Gigachad 5y ago
  Touch controls on stoves are mostly about making cleaning easier. You just wipe a flat surface.
  - tpxl 5y ago
    I'd like to introduce you to my grandmother's flat surface stove from the 70s with 0 touch controls. It's easy, just decouple the controls from the heating element. 3/4 of the reason they're touch is being 'cool' and none of the designers ever cooking a meal in their life.
    - vel0city 5y ago
      Messes go further than just the heating element. Things splatter, run over. Even with controls on the face of the range (not always practical) you may need to clean them from messes. Its definitely easy to clean my entire range being a flat piece of glass, and personally I've never had any problems with sensitivity on the buttons. Plus, that whole cook top is then still useful as a counter top as even the glass is only slightly raised over the rest of the counter surface. In my experience the glass top range I have has been wonderful, and I was originally planning on tearing it out and putting in a gas unit. I've since second guessed those plans and will probably keep the range for a while longer, no knobs has actually been pretty nice.

k3liutZu 5y ago

Really seems Tesla is regressing a lot of _important_ controls :(

darksaints 5y ago

Holy shit, everything about that Tesla experience is a nightmare.

yakshaving_jgt 5y ago

I am stunned. I am never buying a car that decides for me if I should be going forwards or in reverse. How did this anti-feature go through so many supposedly smart people? Does PHB work there also?

llbeansandrice 5y ago

That second video is horrifying. Horn and signal inputs as touch buttons on a steering wheel and no clear gear selection? What absolute madness by Tesla.

flavius29663 5y ago

how is that Tesla even legal?

esalman 5y ago
it makes a mockery of so many absurd rules other manufacturers in the US have to follow. Really raises question how Tesla get away with these.