5 ms·

Just anecdotally, the "yoga, spiritual, new age" people I know are BY FAR the most egotistical group of people I have ever met. I lived in Bali as a digital nom

by anm89 5y ago

Just anecdotally, the "yoga, spiritual, new age" people I know are BY FAR the most egotistical group of people I have ever met. I lived in Bali as a digital nomad where these people are one of the core cohorts and it is very noticeable. Interestingly they are also, again anecdotally, on average a standard deviation or two more attractive than Americans on average. I think it is somehow related to a people who have grown up with people fawning over them and having people hanging off of their words and confirming everything they say and do. Then someone comes along and tells them that they can control their destiny and reality with their mind and crystals or whatever and it feels intuitively correct to them. Then they start projecting these ideas and get lots of positive feedback from their echo chamber. It's really fascinating to watch from a distance.

WaxedChewbacca 5y ago
carlmr 5y ago
>"yoga, spiritual, new age" people I know are BY FAR the most egotistical group of people I have ever met. So much this. I think the problem is that they love talking about how enlightened they are to satisfy their narcissism.
- zozbot234 5y ago
  Empirically, egotism and narcissism really get in the way of the kind of mindset that's required for serious insight. It's not so much that meditation makes you less egotistic, it's more the case that you just can't afford to keep feeding those character traits if you're serious about wanting to attain even low-level stream entry, let alone any deeper form of enlightenment. As an aside, enlightenment isn't even that much of a big deal intellectually so there isn't all that much to talk about. Almost all of the purely intellectual content that you'd grok in the process of doing insight meditation, you could find in a good book about, e.g. philosophical Stoicism. There's plenty more insight besides, but as far as we know it's tacit insight that's really hard to describe to outsiders unless for the purpose of actively engaging in the practice. > Then someone comes along and tells them that they can control their destiny and reality with their mind and crystals or whatever Magick is a real thing in this context, but if you're surprised about the "control their destiny and reality" part you're very much missing the point, and taking your perspective on it from silly folk stereotypes. The most successful magick is (1) not engaged in foolishly or for personal, egotistic gain, but rather in pursuit of goals that are going to deeply benefit others. Stated simply, you very much want to go with the collective flow, not against it. (2) not seeking "supernatural" or paranormal outcomes except perhaps at the tiniest, most imperceptible level that would literally be indistinguishable from pure noise. That's not to say that 'unexplainable' things might not sometimes happen, they'll just be rare and always surprising to everyone involved, most of all the supposed initiator; (3) seeking hidden outcomes as opposed to highly visible or evident ones. It's meant to be wholly complementary to the method and thought process of natural magick (i.e. science and tech) not in contrast with it!
jkodroff 5y ago
I have definitely experienced the type of people you're talking about, and they exist in all settings, but I would caution you from developing cynicism toward all practitioners. Virtue/morality/integrity is a key aspect of spiritual practice, one that many worldly people find inconvenient and therefore ignore, which is how you get the type of people you saw in Bali. You can find these people at spiritual centers more rooted in tradition (ashrams, monasteries), but they are far less common in my experience. There are real practitioners out there who fully embrace the practice and the relinquishment and restraint it requires, and when you are in the presence of these beings you can see the beautiful results.

by anm89 5y ago

WaxedChewbacca 5y ago

carlmr 5y ago

>"yoga, spiritual, new age" people I know are BY FAR the most egotistical group of people I have ever met. So much this. I think the problem is that they love talking about how enlightened they are to satisfy their narcissism.

zozbot234 5y ago
Empirically, egotism and narcissism really get in the way of the kind of mindset that's required for serious insight. It's not so much that meditation makes you less egotistic, it's more the case that you just can't afford to keep feeding those character traits if you're serious about wanting to attain even low-level stream entry, let alone any deeper form of enlightenment. As an aside, enlightenment isn't even that much of a big deal intellectually so there isn't all that much to talk about. Almost all of the purely intellectual content that you'd grok in the process of doing insight meditation, you could find in a good book about, e.g. philosophical Stoicism. There's plenty more insight besides, but as far as we know it's tacit insight that's really hard to describe to outsiders unless for the purpose of actively engaging in the practice. > Then someone comes along and tells them that they can control their destiny and reality with their mind and crystals or whatever Magick is a real thing in this context, but if you're surprised about the "control their destiny and reality" part you're very much missing the point, and taking your perspective on it from silly folk stereotypes. The most successful magick is (1) not engaged in foolishly or for personal, egotistic gain, but rather in pursuit of goals that are going to deeply benefit others. Stated simply, you very much want to go with the collective flow, not against it. (2) not seeking "supernatural" or paranormal outcomes except perhaps at the tiniest, most imperceptible level that would literally be indistinguishable from pure noise. That's not to say that 'unexplainable' things might not sometimes happen, they'll just be rare and always surprising to everyone involved, most of all the supposed initiator; (3) seeking hidden outcomes as opposed to highly visible or evident ones. It's meant to be wholly complementary to the method and thought process of natural magick (i.e. science and tech) not in contrast with it!

jkodroff 5y ago

I have definitely experienced the type of people you're talking about, and they exist in all settings, but I would caution you from developing cynicism toward all practitioners. Virtue/morality/integrity is a key aspect of spiritual practice, one that many worldly people find inconvenient and therefore ignore, which is how you get the type of people you saw in Bali. You can find these people at spiritual centers more rooted in tradition (ashrams, monasteries), but they are far less common in my experience. There are real practitioners out there who fully embrace the practice and the relinquishment and restraint it requires, and when you are in the presence of these beings you can see the beautiful results.